:::RHMT::: Real Home Made Turbo
General Category => Engine Management => Topic started by: Minor Threat on December 13, 2009, 04:55:36 PM
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Using DS-MAP free software (http://forums.ds-map.net/index.php (http://forums.ds-map.net/index.php))and an Ostrich and a logging cable, you can convert your DSM over to speed density.
The following method also works on 1G/2G DSM EPROM ECU's for DSM Link installs.
Note: Use the following guide at your own risk, I'm not responsible if you screw something up.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg683.imageshack.us%2Fimg683%2F8072%2F77952070.jpg&hash=a6f171a99c56954f52cf62da9f8fce6ce6dc3b9d)
Get yourself to this stage, the stock chip that you need to remove is in the top right corner of the board pictured. Before you go any further, clean the bottom of the board around the chip pins with acetone/mineral spirits/mild solvent and a toothbrush, Mitsu ECU's have a coating on them that prevents you from getting a clean solder joint so make sure it's good and clean.
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Use a Dremel or rotary tool to cut the pins off the chip. You'll want a cutoff wheel, some safety glasses and a steady hand to do it. Go slow, you don't need to apply much pressure to cut through the thin pins, and don't worry about cutting into the eprom. When you're done carefully pry the chip loose, it may still be stuck to the board with residue. You'll want to clean the board off with compressed air as well.
A lot of people will probably tell you this is a butcher method of removing an eprom and that you're better to desolder pins from the underside of the board and remove the chip intact. I've never had luck doing that and I've been using this method for a while now with no accidental damage. You're much less likely to rip out a trace (which often ruins a board) with this method.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg683.imageshack.us%2Fimg683%2F1523%2F18250793.jpg&hash=ee09281c131b56a1228ca06fb8e1e65d87708df0)
Aftermath of Dremel attack.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg19.imageshack.us%2Fimg19%2F6823%2F41727004.jpg&hash=2ab38a1a9853baa38a45e43ee430e1223fbf7c2e)
So now you have 28 pins stuck in the board.
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Take your soldering iron and heat the underside of the board and the pin at the same time. Best to do this with your good hand, as you'll need your other hand free at the same time for...
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Use a small set of needle nose pliers to grip the pin from the other side while you use your soldering iron to melt the solder. Wiggle slowly to make sure it's loose, then pull it out. If you feel resistance, stop, and figure out why before you try and use brute force. All these pins should practically fall out once the solder is heated up.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg19.imageshack.us%2Fimg19%2F3503%2F52960176.jpg&hash=4dfc8efad73a5a91816acced1f7bae68175f3e8a)
Use copper Desoldering braid, or a desoldering gun/bulb and remove the access solder from all the holes. I often find it's easier to go over and fill every hole back up with fresh solder before doing this. Desoldering something that's half full is harder.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg694.imageshack.us%2Fimg694%2F1350%2F30547302.jpg&hash=032815e2727b344cba2cc08ce444397e32d2ee8a)
Put your 28 pin socket in the spot where the old chip was. Solder each pin, don't use too much solder or it will pool and make contact with other pins on the underside of the socket where you can't see it.
Put your ECU back together, plug your Ostrich into your socket and you're ready to go!
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ECU IS CHIPPABLE IF you have a 28 pin right on dsm ecu's? i have one in my car i think but i'd like to buy up a 2nd.
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Yeah, if it has a 28 pin eprom in it already then you're good to go. Not all of them do. I scored this one at the wreckers, havn't even checked my own car yet.
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Yeah, if it has a 28 pin eprom in it already then you're good to go. Not all of them do. I scored this one at the wreckers, havn't even checked my own car yet.
You forgot to mention replacing the caps if it hasnt been done yet.
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Yeah, I haven't had to do it yet, and this ECU already has new caps in it from what I can tell.
Robb what are the symptoms of bad caps?
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Yeah, I haven't had to do it yet, and this ECU already has new caps in it from what I can tell.
Robb what are the symptoms of bad caps?
On a dsm, fuel pump runs intermittently or not at all. On csms, damn thing just wont start.
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neat stuffs
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neat stuffs
Yeah, there are seriously maybe 10 people who really dug into the mitsu ecus and wrote code (dsmap guys are at least 2 of them) and there is alot of dsmtards who would rather pay for 'Link, an inferior product, than a $20 chipset and free grassroots software like DSmap/jackal/werewolf. At this point I'd rather talk tech with a rotard than the fools building dsms these days, present company not included.
Good writeup Minor. Build thread on your car?
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someone needs to photoshop the chip growing legs and walking off the circuit :)
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someone needs to photoshop the chip growing legs and walking off the circuit :)
And if a chip had a crank, that would mean something. ;)
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its a DSM.... ;)
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its a DSM.... ;)
That just means something attached to the motor is going to break, like the trans, harness, chassis, etc. Not necessarily the motor itself. Didnt you know? The lord almighty designed the 4g63 right before he gave Smoky Yunick the head designs for the LS1.
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technically it is indirectly attached LOL
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ahhh man that 4g63..... that motor wouldnt die. when i was young (18) and didnt know shit about cars, I had a a 1st gen eclipse and drove it up-hill 5-6 miles with the T-stat shut. It burned up all the coolant, burned all the oil, and made the most fucked up pig squeeling metal clanking noise i ever heard a car make.
I pulled over at a gas station. Bought 4 quarts of oil, 1gallon of coolant, filled it up, and let it cool down for 15 mins. and the car was fine after that.
It went on to last 2 more years of careless abuse.
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neat stuffs
Yeah, there are seriously maybe 10 people who really dug into the mitsu ecus and wrote code (dsmap guys are at least 2 of them) and there is alot of dsmtards who would rather pay for 'Link, an inferior product, than a $20 chipset and free grassroots software like DSmap/jackal/werewolf. At this point I'd rather talk tech with a rotard than the fools building dsms these days, present company not included.
Good writeup Minor. Build thread on your car?
When I get around to building it, there will be a thread. For now you'll just get threads about fixing busted shit.
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We have to not only register, but make 5 posts before we can dl the software. >:(
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Yeah but it's free. Make 5 dumb posts or something.
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Seems like a good tuning software tho. Been reading all the fucking stickies. Still unsure of how exactly they log, or if you can burn a chip(what chip to use?)after you're done tuning with the ostrich.
Seems a lot like Crome in its early stages. Just hope it doesn't turn out like crome is now.
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Seems like a good tuning software tho. Been reading all the fucking stickies. Still unsure of how exactly they log, or if you can burn a chip(what chip to use?)after you're done tuning with the ostrich.
Seems a lot like Crome in its early stages. Just hope it doesn't turn out like crome is now.
Werewolf is gonna cost something like $30 or so, Jackal will always be free.
The 5 posts thing is to ward off dsmtards who shouldnt touch a car. Its their way of screening noobs. Post something semi-intelligent pls.
You can make your own logging cable, and use jackal's logging software or any of the other free dsm loggers. You can burn a chip when your done, but most just leave the ostrich hooked up.
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Nice write up.
If anybody needs a 1G eprom ecu I have 2 one that is socketed and 1 that is not.
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Seems like a good tuning software tho. Been reading all the fucking stickies. Still unsure of how exactly they log, or if you can burn a chip(what chip to use?)after you're done tuning with the ostrich.
Seems a lot like Crome in its early stages. Just hope it doesn't turn out like crome is now.
Werewolf is gonna cost something like $30 or so, Jackal will always be free.
The 5 posts thing is to ward off dsmtards who shouldnt touch a car. Its their way of screening noobs. Post something semi-intelligent pls.
You can make your own logging cable, and use jackal's logging software or any of the other free dsm loggers. You can burn a chip when your done, but most just leave the ostrich hooked up.
I think werewolf is gonna be in the 100$ range, IIRC. Still worth it compared to DSMlink, which is a glorified AFC.
You log thru the ALDL OBD1 diagnostic port, you can get the cables off ebay for 25 bucks or make your own with a serial cable.
You log thru Jackal, and RTP with the Ostrich. If you want to burn a rom and put it on a chip, I'm pretty sure there's a bin save option, otherwise just read your Ostrich with your chip burner.
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Is there no datalogging header you have to install like in obd1 honda ecus? just a 28pin socket and an ostrichs is it?
I've never messed with DSM stuff, seems like I need to try it out: nice post.
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Is there no datalogging header you have to install like in obd1 honda ecus? just a 28pin socket and an ostrichs is it?
I've never messed with DSM stuff, seems like I need to try it out: nice post.
Data logging cable plugs into the ALDL plug. Logging from one com port while tuning from another. A 2 usb laptop with windows xp will suffice.
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Where is the other usb plugging into the ECU? , hondas have a hulog and an ostrich with this method I am only seeing where the ostrich plugs into the 28pin socket, or am I over looking something?
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A one usb laptop with a USB hub and windows xp will suffice.
Fixed.
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Where is the other usb plugging into the ECU? , hondas have a hulog and an ostrich with this method I am only seeing where the ostrich plugs into the 28pin socket, or am I over looking something?
The usb-to-ecu cable plugs into the aldl diag socket.
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RHMB recognized nigga wut.
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is there software available online?
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is there software available online?
How about you re-read the thread and think about that.
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DOH
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How differant are the dsm ecu's to the EVO 1-3 eprom ecu's? Will I have to run a differant program than what you have sugested above? Im trying to work out if its worth staying with the standard ecu or going to a local ecu that iv success with before (Link G4 storm).
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I have no idea but the guys on the site should know.
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All dsm and evo ecus are interchangable in one way or another. I could make an evo9 ecu work on a 91 dsm if I wanted. The basic structure is the same, but evo 1-3 will use the later 1g cas, so yes it would work, but there might be some weird idle issues or something dumb like that.
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I wonder how difficult it would be to retrofit DSM cas bits into a toyota DLI unit and then run DSMlink. Im curious, ill look into this.
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I wonder how difficult it would be to retrofit DSM cas bits into a toyota DLI unit and then run DSMlink.
Are you a fucking moron?
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I wonder how difficult it would be to retrofit DSM cas bits into a toyota DLI unit and then run DSMlink. Im curious, ill look into this.
LOLS omy god Bite the fucking Curb!
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I wonder how difficult it would be to retrofit DSM cas bits into a toyota DLI unit and then run DSMlink.
Are you a fucking moron?
Yes.
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From what i know an e 1-3 rom is different enough that dsm programs dont work, but close enough that anyone who knows about them can get them up and runing, however there is software avliable written for the evo 1-3 already to chip ecu's.
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From what i know an e 1-3 rom is different enough that dsm programs dont work, but close enough that anyone who knows about them can get them up and runing, however there is software avliable written for the evo 1-3 already to chip ecu's.
Seriously? They made over 1 million dsms. It aint that hard to find an ecu to swap in.
Im in the process of swapping my 6-bolt 4g63 into the colt, and so far its an easier swap than any honda. 14 wires to pin in on the body side, since the harness splits ecu functions on another branch. Pretty fucking simple, no jumper harness bs here.
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God damn naysayers, putting the 1g cas guts into my DLI unit is eeeeasy. I could do this shit in a few days and rewire oem free software management goodness. Everyone knows 80s toyota ignition is terrible, and I'm convinced this will run nicer than my megasquirt with ford parts.
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God damn naysayers, putting the 1g cas guts into my DLI unit is eeeeasy. I could do this shit in a few days and rewire oem free software management goodness. Everyone knows 80s toyota ignition is terrible, and I'm convinced this will run nicer than my megasquirt with ford parts.
Er, I think they were referencing the fact that a honda dizzy is very easy to make work on toyota S and G series motors, and has been proven reliable.
I like mitsu and all, but given the choice the Honda ecu has more functionallity, backing, and ease of use. For your needs, the honda ecu/dizzy route is the better choice.
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4A is going to have to have an adapter made to keep the Honda dist from leaking oil all over the place - the o-ringed recess is bigger diameter than the Honda's, which is in turn bigger than the S-motors.
TTC, sir, if you put DSMLink on that car I will drive to your house and fist your mother.
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I wouldn't be putting the honda distributor in the stock location. Its to fucking huge, and gets in the way of my manifold. If im to do it It would go on the front of the cam gear.
I have it figured out, and a buddy is sending me a cam and cam gear since i threw my spares out. The best way for me to make it work is to take a large bolt and machine it down to m12 and slot the larger bolt head to accept the bottom of the honda dizzy key. I remember when i researched it that the hond dizzy is a sealed unit and doesnt need to be oiled iirc.
So basicallyi id do it the same as the pgmfi fellas, as far as the VSS I would probably disconnect that as well as the IAC. Apparantly you can just hook up the VSS and leave it somewhere in the engine bay, if i still had the oem cluster I could most likely send a signal to it from there.
My mother does need a good fisting tho.
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There is no proper VSS delete for any of the Honda code. You'll get CELs if you decel in gear, the ECU is able to figure out from abnormally high vacuum + the revs not falling immediately to idle that the vehicle is moving with no VSS. Some codebases this causes hiccoughs, or loss of some of the cool functionality you get by running Honda code.
As long as the Toy VSS output is a 0-5v square wave, it doesn't matter if the signal is "correct" as you can make it work for you even if it claims 60 mph is 30 in the datalogs. Toy/Honda are brother/sister vehicles running 95% identical Denso sensors, point of fact I wouldn't be surprised if the 90s Toy VSS operated on the same principle which is two pulses per wheel rotation.
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The toyota VSS' are identical and produce the same square wave. My problem is that my old ass tranny has no electric vss, its cable driven to my speedo. What if i used some abs sensors on my driveshaft to send a signal to the ecu? I guess i could run a new cluster lol, from another yota or a honda.
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You could mount a hall sensor on driveshaft or wheel or the like.
You sure there's no VSS input to the ECU on your car? Might be like Honda of that era, located at the end of your speedo cable on the back of the cluster.
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There is a VSS on the back of my speedo. But ive done this and im not sure its reversable, I'm going to check the back of the cluster, well wahts left of it to see if I can salvage some of the circuitry.
So as you can see the only thing left is my speedo, and the circuitry is pretty much gone in the rear. But their is a VSS sensor of some sort on the back of the speedo that the ecu used to receive.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi7.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fy270%2Fturbotincan%2FDSC02532.jpg&hash=ca522a1f25d0872cea6d0dd8ffb8f3fa7b273017)
Is the honda VSS just a single wire or is it a signal wire and ground.
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You could mount a hall sensor on driveshaft or wheel or the like.
You sure there's no VSS input to the ECU on your car? Might be like Honda of that era, located at the end of your speedo cable on the back of the cluster.
It is exactly like a honda. Should be a purple or purple/white wire coming from the back of the cluster to the ecu, pin A10 (almost always on toys).
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Defi make a quartz analogue clock? like the hyundai pony has instead of a tach? that would win.
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The toyota VSS' are identical and produce the same square wave. My problem is that my old ass tranny has no electric vss, its cable driven to my speedo. What if i used some abs sensors on my driveshaft to send a signal to the ecu? I guess i could run a new cluster lol, from another yota or a honda.
I was gonna say, even with a cable output, it usually will feed into a vss of some sort. Only non-injected cars will really have a pure cable-driven speedo.
BTW that driveshaft idea just gave me an idea. Using that abs/axle idea, some random electronic parts (diodes, vr, and transistor) could make a wheel size- & FD ratio-independant VSS. Not that it matters a whole lot, just another oddball project I'll probably never use.
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How's that ecu socket coming captain failbox., Oh wait, I know exactly how.