:::RHMT::: Real Home Made Turbo
General Category => Hybrid/Tech => Topic started by: turbohf on October 24, 2014, 02:59:43 PM
-
so manifold in question would be H22A in all motor forum. I won't buy a skunk2 or other manifold cuz I'm a Jew.
what would yelled the best power? no so much concerned with peak power as I am with a solid flat torque curve.
i have been searching and some stuff seems to be missleading.
leave it all and lightly port and match everything
remove iabs?
remove iabs and plate?
leave plate but gut/port it?
then i have seen a couple gut/cut the ports almost all the way to the bottom. making a super plenum and short runners
so yeah. what's the theory with this?.... remember I want more torque. motor will be higher compression with cams and shit to match....
-
More torque, usually less revs => Long runners
More HP, usually more revs => Short runners.
I remember talking to Chris M about this a years back, he took the upper plenum, IABs, and spacer and put two TBs (not sure what size).
Granted that would be favorable towards less torque more HP.
But this is just a out of the ordinary idea.
Maybe cleanup the ports, keep the IABs and spacer see what you get. Then get rid of IABS and spacer and see if that will satisfy. :noel:
-
yeah I remember chris talking about odd shit like that. would like to keep in mostly simple if possible.
I guess I could swap out a gutted spacer and or double spacer setup on the dyno. wouldn't be too hard to do on the fly. but also not sure what kind of hood clearance I will have?
bottom end will be a 2.3L... so lower rev'er.
-
gut iab plate x2 stack em up hog the fuck out of everything. bigger is better on h22
-
gut iab plate x2 stack em up hog the fuck out of everything. bigger is better on h22
see i have heard that, but i have seen a couple dynos where the torque was fuckin dead down low, it comes back after VTEC to make more tq and hp... but if it kills it down low this swap is void. ill look for them again to make this a informative posts.
-
gut iab plate x2 stack em up hog the fuck out of everything. bigger is better on h22
see i have heard that, but i have seen a couple dynos where the torque was fuckin dead down low, it comes back after VTEC to make more tq and hp... but if it kills it down low this swap is void. ill look for them again to make this a informative posts.
Are you running an H or B trans? If B trans, torque numbers are almost irrelevant, even an H22 with "low" torque numbers still makes more torque than a B series.
If H trans, ain't nobody got time fo dat.
-
http://www.blacktrax.net/products/IntakeManifolds.html (http://www.blacktrax.net/products/IntakeManifolds.html) <~ couple dynos there... say they have IAB's but look at the dynos, wicked torque loss right off the bat?!?!
here is a nice one actually:
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm8.staticflickr.com%2F7049%2F6916557387_cba3622b0d_b.jpg&hash=fd1bba9761a51d6603467cea71fb233021354d44)
http://mnhondas.com/showthread.php?t=20805 (http://mnhondas.com/showthread.php?t=20805)
JDM H22
H22 intake manifold & throttle body
Bisimoto header
3†full exhaust
3†BLOX VS
Hand Command chipped P28 + crome
PS still attached
AC still attached
Balance Shafts still attached
92 pump gas
non B series tranny
http://www.theoldone.com/articles/h22a_head/ (http://www.theoldone.com/articles/h22a_head/) <~ Larry's thoughts... no dynos tho.
-
gut iab plate x2 stack em up hog the fuck out of everything. bigger is better on h22
see i have heard that, but i have seen a couple dynos where the torque was fuckin dead down low, it comes back after VTEC to make more tq and hp... but if it kills it down low this swap is void. ill look for them again to make this a informative posts.
Are you running an H or B trans? If B trans, torque numbers are almost irrelevant, even an H22 with "low" torque numbers still makes more torque than a B series.
If H trans, ain't nobody got time fo dat.
B-series trans.... S80/GSR gears, ITR LSD.... but my last CX had a B20VTEC, made 220whp/148ft... some of these H22 dynos im seeing ONLY beat the torque well into VTEC. i want torque down low too, and to hold it out...
-
The problem with those graphs is how the engine specs compare. You're looking at dyno numbers for a 90.7mm stroke but you'll be running a 97mm stroke. You're also looking at numbers with no tuning, stock 10-ish compression, stock cams, and OEM intake manifold.
Here's a better idea what a higher CR H22/F23 combo will net with a ported OEM intake manifold (note the Type-S cams are barely any bigger than H22 cams). This guy, PirateMcFred, did everything a person should do to make the engine perform better while keeping it very simple. It makes your 220whp/148wtq B20V look like a B16 with all the torque it brings. IIRC he only ported the manifold & IAB's but left them functional. I can't find his original build thread that shows specifically what he did.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi45.tinypic.com%2F6z7cl1.gif&hash=3302eb549b729435b447dc4d744866205bfba12e)
http://570sx.blogspot.com/2010/08/ok-old-beater-nonvtec-g23-has-nearly.html (http://570sx.blogspot.com/2010/08/ok-old-beater-nonvtec-g23-has-nearly.html)
BTW here's a 12:1CR 220whp B20/V dyno I used for comparison. It shows poor torque below 4k compared to an H22 with comparable work, and it's still not better than any of the 190whp H22 graphs off the blacktrax website.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi630.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fuu27%2Fgreenmulatto%2F1238127923.jpg&hash=fbb43e2336bd6bd288644c0a2a3cfaaa7eb8d8e8)
This is how I feel about "low torque" below 4k. My H23A has a K20A2 manifold on it which I think is comparable down low to the OEM manifold with IAB's removed. I recently borrowed my parent's spare car, a 1.8L (?) Astra, and I keep bogging it because I'm so used to NOT downshifting my H23A. I mean I only use 1st gear when I'm stopped, 2nd gear is fine for nearly any rolling stop.
-
The theory behind intake manifolds is the direct air into the engine.
Everyone should run a K20 intake manifold. They are a direct bolt on for most engines.
-
The theory behind intake manifolds is the direct air into the engine.
Everyone should run a K20 intake manifold. They are a direct bolt on for most engines.
They also fit better, the dual-runner H22 IM needed the brake prop valve moved while the PRB manifold did not.
-
The theory behind intake manifolds is the direct air into the engine.
lol, was actually waiting for that response.
The theory behind intake manifolds is the direct air into the engine.
Everyone should run a K20 intake manifold. They are a direct bolt on for most engines.
They also fit better, the dual-runner H22 IM needed the brake prop valve moved while the PRB manifold did not.
fuck, really? im to lazy to move the prop valve.
i just remembered that i do have a PRB manifold.... i guess that makes it a possibility to use.
that ~160fttq at 3200rpms is giving me a chubby.
-
Rhb5 on a d16 will give 180tq at 3000 rpms.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi64.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fh171%2Fiitru45%2Fcar%2520stuff%2FDSC00546.jpg&hash=df6a96e295b64b4ee3496f928432e484d935a1fa) (http://s64.photobucket.com/user/iitru45/media/car%20stuff/DSC00546.jpg.html)
-
i just remembered that i do have a PRB manifold
Everyone should run a K20 intake manifold. They are a direct bolt on for most engines.
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-igktaNegW9s/VE2zux31UbI/AAAAAAAABV8/rIYr-RtNdr4/w1172-h879-no/f22%2Bprb%2Bmanifold%2Bdirect%2Bbolt%2Bon.jpg)
The H22 bolt pattern is a little less optimal than the F22 head, but there is no coolant passage nor hanging thermostat housing to deal with.
-
I just saw a dyno for an H22A with skunk2 k20 IM, skank2 pro1 cams, and 3" exhaust. 214whp & 157wtq, with 150wtq from 3k to 7k and peak HP at 7900. FYI those cams are a bit big for his compression ratio.
K20A2 pistons brings you to 11.5 CR vs his 10.5, and ITR pistons bring an F23/H22 combo to 12:1 CR. I just happen to have a set of ITR's I might never use, so LMK if you'd want them.
-
http://image.superstreetonline.com/f/76893135+w+h+q80+re0+cr1+ar0+st0/1988-honda-CRX-HF-exospeed-three-piece-front-end-04 (http://image.superstreetonline.com/f/76893135+w+h+q80+re0+cr1+ar0+st0/1988-honda-CRX-HF-exospeed-three-piece-front-end-04)
-
http://image.superstreetonline.com/f/76893135+w+h+q80+re0+cr1+ar0+st0/1988-honda-CRX-HF-exospeed-three-piece-front-end-04 (http://image.superstreetonline.com/f/76893135+w+h+q80+re0+cr1+ar0+st0/1988-honda-CRX-HF-exospeed-three-piece-front-end-04)
I would put a hood on it and make it look like a periscope
-
That could work if you put the TB lower & facing up, then the filter tube could spin around.