:::RHMT::: Real Home Made Turbo
General Category => Forced Induction => Topic started by: PhilStubbs on December 03, 2012, 11:09:03 AM
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Here is the start of my crx build thread.
Here is the car. 90-91 crx dx i picked up from SDRAWCAB/Rhino for $300
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi571.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss152%2FSecksyPeePee%2F73CCA99E-0AB1-4756-A2D9-9CB42CD8603E-24059-00001215B9986EA9.jpg&hash=3cdb003a8142598c161a67f9fc9be7ba5f0ae671)
broke ass d15
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi571.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss152%2FSecksyPeePee%2FE4E46E6A-394A-4264-B30F-B18EDEAA2236-24059-00001215C09969F3.jpg&hash=f59295c39e2bde50ee6db69c012d00e9a9a97969)
Free f23.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi571.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss152%2FSecksyPeePee%2F10486674-09B4-4B3B-B814-EE2C62750ECF-24059-00001215C5DFF5CE.jpg&hash=451b8fef524bd82bd8efa865f808268f26117c8a)
no pics of the H22 tranny i got for tuning a couple cars.
A friend sold his accord 6 months ago, then found it in the junk yard a week ago. tells me about a bunch of new parts on it that he put on before selling it. so i went yesterday and got a new flywheel, clutch, arp flywheel bolts, starter and shifter, plus some other crx things i needed for $70. then i get a call as im leaving that puts $50 back in my pocket for playing with an accord and a laptop for a few min.
todays progress was puling the old d15 out
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-snc6%2Fc67.0.403.403%2Fp403x403%2F285765_512677512078532_1810235662_n.jpg&hash=213e308e85337793df5f63dd3419fecdcaf4f0c8)
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-ash3%2Fc67.0.403.403%2Fp403x403%2F581532_512677715411845_1037898425_n.jpg&hash=07eef7d378a82b44adf81f4a4e74f7ee4ede146c)
im a little short on cash right now so buying parts is sort of on hold, at least till friday. during the week im going to work on painting it since i have everything to do it already. more pics to come as the days go
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Today's progress. Being a little short on money has me doing some painting for now since i already have the stuff.
Before:
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-prn1%2F47498_513107718702178_1106348305_n.jpg&hash=25b8e95ae157c9d2db6bec4c80bb525209f9d1fe)
After:
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fsphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net%2Fhphotos-snc7%2F404313_513131365366480_615296572_n.jpg&hash=c086c99646324385f4a7c807200d8540eb85266a)
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Figured this thread was due for an update. Not much visual progress, but lots has been done. Rear disc swap is done, 2/3 mounts, shifter mounted and cables routed. I really like the shifter. Very crisp and short. The previous owner of the shifter rambled on about some prelude shifter, modded etc. don't know but I like it. Anyway
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi571.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss152%2FSecksyPeePee%2F1A6E7A08-8B66-4747-B8B0-CC864725D397-45947-000026E0B5160C0A.jpg&hash=e339569d91b929401bc1a6780409437eafbe8077)
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi571.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss152%2FSecksyPeePee%2F00FDB94C-949F-4754-AB77-05044553711E-45947-000026E0B183C10B.jpg&hash=da76c1883eb5ff1b490d2a1b8fa66f108d72a0ef)
The mounts are ugly as shit right now. I'll get pics once they look as nice as they work.
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Looking good, whats the future plans for the motor?
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I have done lots with boost and I always will have a boosted car. This one is to learn N/A. It has always been kind of a black art or voodoo to me. Once the swap is done and all the bugs are sorted, it will come out for k20 pistons, unknown rods(haven't decided), f22a6 head, a cam of some sort and I'll make my own intake manifold. My goal is mid-low 12's in the 1/4, but I may push it farther. It is also intended to just be a fun street car. My EF has no title so I only drive it at the track. I need something I can rip on when I have a bad day or take out to hurt the feelings of the local ricers.
A lot of the fun of playing with cars has been lost by having a track only car. If I want to play, I have to plan at least a day in advance. The track is 2 hours away. I have to load the car on the trailer, pack all of my tools and shit the night before. Then spend $100 driving there and back. Even if I could drive the car there legally, I couldn't push it for the fear of it breaking and leaving me stuck 2 hours from home.
With the crx, I could just throw the slicks in the car and head out on a whim and spend $20 in gas.
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I have a f23 and a a6 head just laying around. Thinking of some k20a2 rods and pistons with a set of arp's and plenty of boost :noel:
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DO IT!! i love all single cams. thats why its getting an F rather than an H.
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DO IT!! i love all single cams. thats why its getting an F rather than an H.
Crx needs a few things then some 4dr love. I wonder if I could get both to were I want by rhmt 2013 ne meet?
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Once the swap is done and all the bugs are sorted, it will come out for k20 pistons, unknown rods(haven't decided), f22a6 head, a cam of some sort and I'll make my own intake manifold.
Honestly in stock form the F23A1 head outflows the F22Ax. F22A's have pretty shitty exhaust ports (in stock form), the real advantage there is that as far as I know they don't have a water jacket around the exhaust ports, so you can open them up a whole lot more. Another advantage is that you can put a dual runner intake mani on them (both the F22A6 and H23A1 intake's fit).
But yeah, unless you are gonna do port work, just keep the F23 head on the motor.
The F22B1 and B2 heads are pretty lousy though.
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Yea, the f23 head will be staying for now, then get crazy on the non vtec head later.
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Once the swap is done and all the bugs are sorted, it will come out for k20 pistons, unknown rods(haven't decided), f22a6 head, a cam of some sort and I'll make my own intake manifold.
Honestly in stock form the F23A1 head outflows the F22Ax. F22A's have pretty shitty exhaust ports (in stock form), the real advantage there is that as far as I know they don't have a water jacket around the exhaust ports, so you can open them up a whole lot more. Another advantage is that you can put a dual runner intake mani on them (both the F22A6 and H23A1 intake's fit).
But yeah, unless you are gonna do port work, just keep the F23 head on the motor.
The F22B1 and B2 heads are pretty lousy though.
I always heard the opposite of this, that f22a's flow a lot more but the cam makes it lack luster.
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I have heard pretty much the same. Either way, 100% stock the f23 is better, but the F22a6 has more potential is my understanding
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soooo....this is a NA build in the FI section? ::)
looks...well shitty so far lol, but progress is being made. you clean up the inside/outside of teh car yet?
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I think a lot of the skewed info is because the F23 has the word "VTEC" on the valve cover. The head flows well, but the camshaft sucks balls. I presume it's closer in lift/duration to e-vtec than anything - low lift and duration won't make much power on any head. Most people have access to the F22A head, and can get a Bisi or Delta cam much easier, which is why it's modded by more people. The F22A cars are also a lot cheaper and lighter, making them more enticing.
Here's an interesting pic I found while researching not long ago:
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fim1.shutterfly.com%2Fmedia%2F47a2dd32b3127cceffcefbbe06f000000030O00AbsWzlw2bOWIPbz4U%2FcC%2Ff%253D0%2Fps%253D50%2Fr%253D0%2Frx%253D720%2Fry%253D480%2F&hash=76578b1a9a57745443acba607d57048abfca8279)
edit: clarified some shit, fixed pic
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soooo....this is a NA build in the FI section? ::)
looks...well shitty so far lol, but progress is being made. you clean up the inside/outside of teh car yet?
Well, the description of the section says
"Forced Induction
Custom FI Setup Questions and Build Threads." No mention of build threads anywhere else on the forum.
I haven't done much cosmetically yet. With my roommate situation not stable, I haven't had any money to get the windshield and 1/4 glass pulled. There is some rust around the windshield and the rubber around the 1/4 glass has shrunk. I would rather pull it all and paint the car rather than deal with taping up stuff that will come out eventually anyway.
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Here's an interesting pic I found while researching not long ago:
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fim1.shutterfly.com%2Fmedia%2F47a2dd32b3127cceffcefbbe06f000000030O00AbsWzlw2bOWIPbz4U%2FcC%2Ff%253D0%2Fps%253D50%2Fr%253D0%2Frx%253D720%2Fry%253D480%2F&hash=76578b1a9a57745443acba607d57048abfca8279)
edit: clarified some shit, fixed pic
Take a wild guess who compiled that info...
Here it is, slightly bigger and clearer, that looks like it was saved and uploaded and compressed a couple times:
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi15.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa380%2Foverdrive14%2FAccordHeadFlowNumbers.jpg&hash=3f70b51331dbc79277eba7c54a369d28bbe46665)
Anyways, if you aren't touching the ports beyond cleaning up casting flaws, it seems like F23A head plus cam that doesn't suck balls is the way to go.
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The F23A cam only has 4 more lobes to regrind (20 vs 16), so I'd guess Delta would do it under $130. If I was doing it, I'd go 260* or a step lower for primary intake, 272 or 282 for the vtec secondary lobes, and either 260 or 272 for exhaust. I'd go with the lesser duration if it was mostly a street motor.
From what I've seen, a basic 272 Delta with pull 150-160whp with just I/H/E vs a stock I/H/E H22 that will do ~165whp. A 12:1 F22A6/F23 combo with a Delta 272 will do near 200whp, so a better head and bigger vtec lobes should push an high-CR F23 over 200whp.
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Delta told me $95 for a 272
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Thats better than I thought. I recall people saying that for a 16-lobe f22 cam, not a 20-lobe cam.
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Maybe they misunderstood, but I did my best to let them know it was vtec
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Damn thats a steal! I think im going to go 282 or bigger if they dare make it :evil:
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I have a feeling 272 is as big as they go on the F. That was the impression I got in the email
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I have a feeling 272 is as big as they go on the F. That was the impression I got in the email
I was tossing around the idea of a colt tri flow but its a bit more.
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My impression was the person handling email can't tell the difference between a camshaft up his ass and a hotrex camping trip surprise. If you call them, you'll get much better info.
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I really wish I had some pics to post. Been working on this thing pretty hardcore, but nothing looks different. Engine mounts are structurally done, but need some cosmetic work. I want these mounts to look like I bought them. Also boxed in the frame where I had to cut for room and the rear crossmember. Only a few minor things left to fire it off the first time. The fuel inlet on the rail is in a retarded place. Haven't decided how ill handle that. Probably switch to -an fittings and braided hose. I have plenty laying around. Also need to dremil the injector plugs or swap in some obd1 injectors. I only get about an hour or 2 at the most each weeknight to work on it.
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I suggest 2 options:
A) Banjo to barb fittings.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Aluminum-banjo-adaptor-9mm-Barb-M12-12-1mm-15-32-inch-/251124199348?hash=item3a782b2fb4&item=251124199348&pt=Race_Car_Parts&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Aluminum-banjo-adaptor-9mm-Barb-M12-12-1mm-15-32-inch-/251124199348?hash=item3a782b2fb4&item=251124199348&pt=Race_Car_Parts&vxp=mtr)
Specifically that auction is not the best since it's in Hong Kong, but you get the idea. 2 of those and some high-pressure hose. Note - a similar fitting will be found on many non-Hondas' power steering lines. You can also try the banjo to AN if you get one with a long enough nipple. FYI the banjo will be a 12mm hole.
long nipple AN-Banjo:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHROME-3-STRAIGHT-7-16-BANJO-ADAPTER-/330301163763?hash=item4ce77bc8f3&item=330301163763&pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHROME-3-STRAIGHT-7-16-BANJO-ADAPTER-/330301163763?hash=item4ce77bc8f3&item=330301163763&pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr)
B) Drivers-side exit H22 fuel rail flipped left to right.
The FPR may angle the wrong way, but the offset between the injector's centerline and the 3 bolts' centerline is identical besides the F23 bolts on the top instead of the bottom. For the 2 outer studs you'll have to get some threaded rod and make your own, since the spacing is wider by 1/2" each side. I was going that route until I remembered the CBR banjo fittings I had.
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speedway motors has a bunch of differant banjo fittings for cheap and good quality and service to boot.
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I have a bunch of -an hoses with 90° fittings. I'll probably tap the rail where the banjo fitting is now with npt, put a npt-an fitting in there. I also have a few stock hoses. They all have a lot of hard line off the banjo part. Could just cut that and use with some hose. Just trying to decide how much work I want to put into it.
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Ok, been a long ass time since I touched this car. Had some intake clearance issues I wasn't sure how to handle, I got discouraged, worked on other shit but now I'm back on it. I'm broke as shit right now, but luckily there is tons of work I can do without spending any money and I have some time to do it.
Pics of today's progress.
Shitty tps-firewall clearance along with fuel filter and heater hose shit.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi571.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss152%2FSecksyPeePee%2FB8383860-6CA6-4BE8-A3AE-654FF1DD2078-1298-000001465BC56182_zpsc3c7edb1.jpg&hash=d6a0f143a126fc162a9306ea968ceceda92fe8a3)
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi571.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss152%2FSecksyPeePee%2F19B8CC88-D15A-4818-9634-4C1DD97A4913-1298-000001465F4C1546_zps300a236c.jpg&hash=458be6f6adba7325612188fadc84fdd8e18d081e)
1" thick aluminum plate. Acts as a spacer and an adaptor so I can run a different F plenum. One with a standard IACV.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi571.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss152%2FSecksyPeePee%2F890B6981-ED60-4671-9909-7E6807A90E28-1298-0000014663910F05_zps3bde33ca.jpg&hash=c409bc0ac986d8a24a2b88d4a461fe6a35a25bf7)
I didn't get any pics, but that spacer puts the tps and IACV into that nook at the top of the firewall and also fixes the clearance with the TB, fuel filter and heater hose valve.
(https://realhomemadeturbo.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi571.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fss152%2FSecksyPeePee%2FCB0C6CBB-C233-414F-97A2-3F2D1CEFB756-1298-0000014667A9966D_zps41209c98.jpg&hash=165f34fddd63b706ec7c17069351a514619da989)
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Homemade spacer=WIN!
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Surprisingly, it only took about 30min with a hole saw to make all 4 holes on a small HF drill press. I'll worry about cosmetics later. For now I just want to hear it run
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Any updates on this? :noel:
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There's a spacer on the market that's relatively cheap to bolt the F22 IACV onto the F23 plenum. That's how most people do the F23 mani swap on the F22Bx engines (supposedly makes them actually pull to redline rather than falling on their face at 5200rpm).
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No real updates. Life is keeping me from it right now.
I don't have room for an iacv spacer. I made the mounts with only axle angle in mind and ignored the rest. I have that sorted out though. I may touch the car again before the year is over, but I'm not really expecting to
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If your friends gave a shit they'd draw dicks on the dust accumulating on the car for the next 5+ months.
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They do that
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No real updates. I am lazy, and generally suck as a human being.
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Says the guy that has never posted half the build thread I have here
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At least his thread has SOME porn in it.
Run a remote IACV. Cut a chunk to bolt the IACV to, thread nipples in behind the in/outlet holes, then run them to the intake tube & right to the plenum. You can also run it to the brake booster line with a tee. Personally I'd love to get the F23 IM/Plenum to test with the f22 272 cam I have sitting here. Right now it's shifting sooner than the b16 I had in it before, so I'd love to raise the redline on the cheap.
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Why is everyone so into the iacv thing? The problem has been solved for months
1" thick aluminum plate. Acts as a spacer and an adaptor so I can run a different F plenum. One with a standard IACV.
I didn't get any pics, but that spacer puts the tps and IACV into that nook at the top of the firewall and also fixes the clearance with the TB, fuel filter and heater hose valve.
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Why is everyone so into the iacv thing? The problem has been solved for months
1" thick aluminum plate. Acts as a spacer and an adaptor so I can run a different F plenum. One with a standard IACV.
I didn't get any pics, but that spacer puts the tps and IACV into that nook at the top of the firewall and also fixes the clearance with the TB, fuel filter and heater hose valve.
Because the F22 plenum blows?
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100% custom intake is in the works, just making it run first
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Why is everyone so into the iacv thing? The problem has been solved for months
1" thick aluminum plate. Acts as a spacer and an adaptor so I can run a different F plenum. One with a standard IACV.
I didn't get any pics, but that spacer puts the tps and IACV into that nook at the top of the firewall and also fixes the clearance with the TB, fuel filter and heater hose valve.
Because the F22 plenum blows?
And because 1" longer runners blows? lol
When you get the custom manifold done, I'll buy the F23 manifold/plenum off you.
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Why is everyone so into the iacv thing? The problem has been solved for months
1" thick aluminum plate. Acts as a spacer and an adaptor so I can run a different F plenum. One with a standard IACV.
I didn't get any pics, but that spacer puts the tps and IACV into that nook at the top of the firewall and also fixes the clearance with the TB, fuel filter and heater hose valve.
Because the F22 plenum blows?
And because 1" longer runners blows? lol
When you get the custom manifold done, I'll buy the F23 manifold/plenum off you.
Longer runners might not be the worst thing in the world for these engines. Actually if you gutted the stock plenum and gutted out part of the spacer to increase plenum volume you'd probably be improving at least on the F22 parts. Like I said, in stock form they fall flat at 5200rpm.
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shorter runners plz
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Says the guy that has never posted half the build thread I have here
I could flood EM woth a bunch of electronics projects no one would understand, half of which are reversing something that could possibly to definitely get my panties sued off.
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Or you cud spout big claims and deliver like hotrex
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Or you cud spout big claims and deliver like hotrex
I like my way better. lol
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JD's projects are always 66% bandwidth.
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2 posts copied from another forum I posted on.
Finally got motivated and a little free time to devote to this car. Handling the paint and bodywork from the fire wall back for now. Once i drive it some and work the bugs out, then I'll pull the engine to build it and get the engine bay shaved and such.
Stripping down to bare metal. The factory paint was so bad, I cant put fresh paint back on top of it.
Treated with ospho to help with current rust and give me a little time to get it sealed back up.
(https://scontent-a-mia.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/t1.0-9/10156157_777266265619654_6379293653733631275_n.jpg)
(https://scontent-a-mia.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/t1.0-9/1901332_781822608497353_893284973603605997_n.jpg)
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/t1.0-9/10262239_781822635164017_2543995989882033842_n.jpg)
Little progress saturday. Coated the bare metal in PPG DP90, then a high build primer. Gonna start the little bit of actual body work, then paint. Hopefully it goes quick, it needs very little filler to be super straight.
(https://scontent-a-mia.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/t1.0-9/10341888_862140100466029_513952155145950208_n.jpg)
(https://scontent-b-mia.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/t1.0-9/10348547_791658934180387_5751651864962183851_n.jpg)[/quote]
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Looking good, now do work!
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Put bondo on it yesterday and sanded some out. Finishing that up today and spot priming. Then its just sand for paint.
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you make it sound so simple and easy...
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It is, but I do it daily on planes
No pics tonight, but I did get it all sanded and spot primed except one spot that needs one more coat of filler. All super minor stuff.
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Aloha Sir,
was wondering if you had pics or could share how much mods had to be done to the chassis to clear the motor/trans?
im considering doing an F23 into my crx, but hoping the F2B option AND going plateless would help on clearance issues?
thanks in advance
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Aloha Sir,
was wondering if you had pics or could share how much mods had to be done to the chassis to clear the motor/trans?
im considering doing an F23 into my crx, but hoping the F2B option AND going plateless would help on clearance issues?
thanks in advance
um..... where is your intro post?
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stay wednesday
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stay wednesday
I swear we said that to you a few times. The plateless F2B will help with clearance issues, but right now nobody who's completed it has shown pics. DanZ is about to finish his plateless F2B in a few days or weeks using an F22 and cable trans.
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Yes. Will that stop you from selling me injectors?
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Aloha Sir,
was wondering if you had pics or could share how much mods had to be done to the chassis to clear the motor/trans?
im considering doing an F23 into my crx, but hoping the F2B option AND going plateless would help on clearance issues?
thanks in advance
um..... where is your intro post?
Since when does a Og need a intro post ;) :noel:
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Aloha Sir,
was wondering if you had pics or could share how much mods had to be done to the chassis to clear the motor/trans?
im considering doing an F23 into my crx, but hoping the F2B option AND going plateless would help on clearance issues?
thanks in advance
I don't have any pics. I just cut a small section of frame out on the tranny side and re-boxed it. You'd have to make your own clearance decisions anyway since I made my own mounts to get a better axle angle than the bolt in kits. Plateless F2B would eliminate that anyway. It will just fit, probably have to shave the power steering pulley part of the crank pulley off though. I had to.