Topic: Most effective for wheel hop? (Read 8359 times)

HiProfile · « **on:** January 07, 2010, 04:30:54 PM »

I already have some motor mount inserts, but I get some scary wheel hop when I'm on the sticky drag strip.

I'd like to know what I should do first: poly bushings, or fab up a traction bar? It will be for a 95 Civic. The stock bushings aren't bad, but I've done full poly bushings before.

danz · « **Reply #1 on:** January 07, 2010, 04:42:03 PM »

slicks. there is no other cure.

ryan89crx · « **Reply #2 on:** January 07, 2010, 04:48:09 PM »

Traction bar solved my wheel hop. I tried inserts in all 4 mounts, then added strut rod bushings, but still had hop. Threw on a traction bar and it all went away.

HiProfile · « **Reply #3 on:** January 07, 2010, 06:25:42 PM »

Well I'm not sure slicks would be a good idea the street...

The problem is that viscious shake-the-entire-car, rattle-teeth-loose kinda wheel hop, not simply lack of grip. No peg-legging or 2whl spins, just shaking. The car is part daily driver, part occational racer. I'm doing a gsr build this year, and I'm sure at that point the stock suspension will be flopping all around if I don't do something to it.

I did some mild rpm & high rpm dumps, then tried bogging it intentionally, and it was barely 0.1sec slower. FYI I did preload and partially slip the clutch. IIRC the slips were ~2.1-2.3 for the 60ft, not terrible considering it was with Parada Spec2 205/40/16's that are over 5 yrs old (and my first time trying).

What I was hoping to do is put poly bushings in eventually, and only use the traction bar when I really need it. I'm basicly a 1/4 mile n00b. If you're saying poly bushings did squat, maybe I'll just save my money & time for the bar.

danz · « **Reply #4 on:** January 07, 2010, 07:20:49 PM »

i still had crazy bad wheel hop with my traction bar.

even had wheel hop with solid steel mounts.

maybe its an 88-91 thing... ??

yes, only JD can use slicks on the street and still be cool.

ryan89crx · « **Reply #5 on:** January 07, 2010, 08:04:33 PM »

Quote from: danz on January 07, 2010, 07:20:49 PM

i still had crazy bad wheel hop with my traction bar.

even had wheel hop with solid steel mounts.

maybe its an 88-91 thing... ??

ehh, my '89 CRX suffered from wheel hop pretty bad as well. Poly inserts didn't do a whole lot, they helped, but I would still get wheel hop. I bought a JKMotorsports trac bar way back in the day, installed it and I could launch anywhere, on street tires, slicks, and whatever RPM, and never get wheel hop.

danz · « **Reply #6 on:** January 07, 2010, 08:11:40 PM »

im jealous dude, i really wish my car was like that...

klyph · « **Reply #7 on:** January 07, 2010, 09:44:40 PM »

Adjust your traction bar?

Teg2boo · « **Reply #8 on:** January 07, 2010, 10:39:45 PM »

Quote from: danz on January 07, 2010, 07:20:49 PM

i still had crazy bad wheel hop with my traction bar.

even had wheel hop with solid steel mounts.

maybe its an 88-91 thing... ??

yes, only JD can use slicks on the street and still be cool.

Yeah, JD totaled his car too lol

ADSR · « **Reply #9 on:** January 08, 2010, 12:05:11 AM »

Quote from: ryan89crx on January 07, 2010, 08:04:33 PM

Quote from: danz on January 07, 2010, 07:20:49 PM
i still had crazy bad wheel hop with my traction bar.

even had wheel hop with solid steel mounts.

maybe its an 88-91 thing... ??
ehh, my '89 CRX suffered from wheel hop pretty bad as well. Poly inserts didn't do a whole lot, they helped, but I would still get wheel hop. I bought a JKMotorsports trac bar way back in the day, installed it and I could launch anywhere, on street tires, slicks, and whatever RPM, and never get wheel hop.

great info!

patsmx5 · « **Reply #10 on:** January 08, 2010, 12:43:47 AM »

Fab up a traction bar. That will add another link vs. stiffening the current links. One less degree of freedom.

crttaz · « **Reply #11 on:** January 08, 2010, 02:20:23 AM »

slicks and polys are all you need, 1.81 60 foot SOHC on spray.

HiProfile · « **Reply #12 on:** January 08, 2010, 03:52:44 AM »

I'd guess it might be the motor movement in your EF. Mine just had ES poly and a replacement-style Innovative X-member (not the super-low style), and the wheels would never hop unless the pavement was patched in a million places.

Guess I'll get polys first, since I know what I'm doing there, and can run them on the street. I was thinking I'd mostly remove the traction bar when not at the track.

Foowee · « **Reply #13 on:** January 08, 2010, 05:30:49 AM »

You can run a traction bar on a daily. However, some of them do wierd things to suspension geometry. Amazingly these guys get something right:

http://www.full-race.com/articles/traction_bars.pdf

so if you're gonna make your own, build em so they don't bind on ya... and try to avoid using the front of the lower fork bolt as a mount. I've heard the bars that use this end up pulling the busings out of the lca's.

patsmx5 · « **Reply #14 on:** January 08, 2010, 09:31:55 AM »

Like that link shows, just mount the traction bars pivot on the axis passing through the control arms pivot and it will not bind.

HiProfile · « **Reply #15 on:** January 08, 2010, 01:56:49 PM »

Quote from: Foowee on January 08, 2010, 05:30:49 AM

You can run a traction bar on a daily. However, some of them do wierd things to suspension geometry. Amazingly these guys get something right:

http://www.full-race.com/articles/traction_bars.pdf

so if you're gonna make your own, build em so they don't bind on ya... and try to avoid using the front of the lower fork bolt as a mount. I've heard the bars that use this end up pulling the busings out of the lca's.

I knew some of that, thanks for the pdf link. Reading their stuff makes me think I can keep it on, albeit with more frequent joint replacement. I was already thinking about copying that full race bar, except for adding supports to bolt to the engine torque mounts too. Since every 5th gen traction bar only uses those 6 towhook bolts it probably isn't a problem.

BTW what size do they usually use for traction bar joints? 3/8" threads, 1/2"??

danz · « **Reply #16 on:** January 08, 2010, 09:38:20 PM »

i used 1/2in on mine, ran 10s with 1.6 60fts with it. i used the cheap heims and they are now worn out after about a year of DD and about 100 passes at the strip.

i would go 5/8ths if i did it again...

patsmx5 · « **Reply #17 on:** January 08, 2010, 09:41:23 PM »

If your're worried about life expectancy of the hemis, use quality ones, bigger ones, or buy spares.

ratcityrex · « **Reply #18 on:** January 09, 2010, 03:06:32 AM »

Well here is how I did mine.

Filled mounts, got rid of some hop. (like 15%)
Put all poly bushings in all the suspention helped some (got rid of maybe 10%)

Built a traction bar. END OF ALL WHEEL HOP! helped the other 75%

I too am rocking a 90 ed/ef (what ever the fuck you want to call it) like danz, and I too have a weir traction bar kit like danz, and Have no wheel hop.

My .02, just do the traction bars and call it a day.

Teg2boo · « **Reply #19 on:** January 09, 2010, 01:48:58 PM »

I'm not sure it's related to the thread, but any of you have direction problem when you hit "high" amount of boost?

My car is going from a side to another and I have no control. I wonder if it's just the fucked up street I drive on or if all my direction is fucked.

Torque effect maybe?

90dx · « **Reply #20 on:** January 09, 2010, 02:43:50 PM »

Install a full poly bushing kit,not sure what brand of inserts you have but if there Energy Susp. throw them in the garbage and get Prothane as they are way stiffer and the inserts for mounts you need. Get a alignment after and enjoy raping it daily hop free.

turbohf · « **Reply #21 on:** January 10, 2010, 05:41:34 AM »

i daily drive on a Full-Race traction bar and HASports replacement mounts... i get very little wheel hop. but i do get a little every once in a while. engine does seem to have a little more movement than my swapped CRX back in the day... $:-\$

i asked someone one time at the track, they where running like 10.50s in an EG, what made the most difference the traction bars or the engine mounts or something else. they said the mounts made the most difference.... for what thats worth.

both of mine have been installed together, never ran without one.

turbob16hatch · « **Reply #22 on:** January 10, 2010, 12:31:02 PM »

Quote from: turbohf on January 10, 2010, 05:41:34 AM

i daily drive on a Full-Race traction bar and HASports replacement mounts... i get very little wheel hop. but i do get a little every once in a while. engine does seem to have a little more movement than my swapped CRX back in the day... $:-\$

i asked someone one time at the track, they where running like 10.50s in an EG, what made the most difference the traction bars or the engine mounts or something else. they said the mounts made the most difference.... for what thats worth.

both of mine have been installed together, never ran without one.

What you have to understand is the difference between the eg and the ef/ed.

The eg may beinifit from the mounts more as it uses the 3 point front lca, where it ties back into the crossmember on the backside. this controls caster.

On the ef/ed, it uses radius rods and a front cross member to control caster. This is where the ef/ed will get the gains from switching to a traction bar and eliminating the ease of caster changes the stock set up allows. the ef/ed also has a 4 motor mount setup.

no one i know keeps the 2 bottom torque mounts on the eg's. so that leaves 3 mount to do the job of 5.

these are things that need to be taken into account, as they can get confusing.

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Author Topic: Most effective for wheel hop? (Read 8359 times)

90dx