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[That Guy]

Fuck, I guess this is now another gun thread


I stagger my shit, 00/slug/00/slug/etc.

+1, staggered, with a birdshot in the hole as sort of a more forgiving shot... more forgiving on my shoulder lol

[Conceptz-X]

Fuck foregiving, if I shoot at someone, the coroner is going to be needed

[That Guy]

chances are my mossberg wont be fully shouldered right and would pop me a good one in the face or something with my luck, practice and a real situation are two different stresses on your head. personally i can practice all good and have no mistakes, but in a real situation, jam ups and fuck ups could be the end of me

[Passenger]

For 0-20 ft (home defense) 7 1/2 shot would be fine I bet.

[Corey]

For 0-20 ft (home defense) 7 1/2 shot would be fine I bet.

if youre trying to injure someone.

[Doug]

Springfield 30-6 FTW, it's all I have   

[QikEnuF]

The minimum for real damage to an intruder wearing any kind of clothing is #4 buck, but 00 is always the safe bet

[LS1pwNzJ00]

the .223/5.56 is designed to fragment when it contacts something.  So, it causes a big wound channel, but has issues carrying past whatever it first hits, which is why the 9mm has more penetration in a home defense situation.  Chalk it up to strange but true.  The .223 is also a very light weight projectile in comparison to the typical 147gr JHP 9mm's that people load for HD.  55-77gr projectile that is designed to fragment, vs a 147gr projectile that is not. 

Cliffs: .223 Tumbles once it gets out of wack in flight, and also fragments, so it has issues going through walls.  Not saying a 9mm is a huge penetration risk, but it is much greater than the risk of a .223


Scoooot:  If it is fairy dust, why is it pretty much standard fact in the gun community?  And it's not so much the fragmentation, its the fact that the .223 tumbles after initial impact, also part of its design.

Sure doesn't look like what this guys tests found.
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot1.htm
http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot1_2.htm

9mm JHP penetrated through 8 3/4" pine boards.
.223 went through all 12 boards he had and was still moving, it tumbled but that didn't slow it down that much.

exactly, 223 only fragments are a cerrtain range when it begins to slow down.  IIRC its 150-300yards where you have a good chance of fragmentation.  Even so its still a .223 sized round that MIGHT fragment, vs a .30x round that will not shrink.

[Aero]

The muzzle energy difference between the 9mm and .223 is huge too.
9mm 124 grain JHP at 1180fps  is 383ft/lbs
.223 55 grain at 3240fps 1282 ft/lbs

Kind of a cool little calculator.
http://billstclair.com/energy.html

[Zarcorp]

Up for the day.

It's not the gun owners you worry about - ballistic forensics is a mature science, and if you kill someone with a firearm the odds are you're caught.  If you are worried about murders it's cold blooded motherfuckers who know strange chemical interactions that you worry about.   I know shit I can give you a dose of, with no side effects, and then three weeks later give you a dose of something else and there's a high probability you die. 

Family friend had a bunch of castor beans he didn't want, and I was really tempted to slip some ricen into the old Miami mayor's cocaine.

[Tim]

I watched .223 9mm and 45 all fragment when my old man was ghetto testing knock-down power against 4" x 3/16" thick steel square tubing.


the .223 was the only one the fragments were inside the tube and denting the back side.  Fucked our stand all to hell

[Doug]

Back on track. So US made butterfly knives are ok, just not imported? I bought one back when I was in like 7th grade, still have it around somewhere.

Who had one of these? I had one back in the day

[QikEnuF]

When I finish building my 408 cheytac, that will be new home defense cannon

[RotaryGeek]

Back on track. So US made butterfly knives are ok, just not imported? I bought one back when I was in like 7th grade, still have it around somewhere.

Who had one of these? I had one back in the day

Lol i almost got kicked out of school back in like 4th grade for having one of those. I scared this shit outa the teachers.