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[bigdaddyvtec]

I have respect for you James, all of you guys are good to me... and in no way am I pointing any kind of finger, but to clear something up... He does indeed portray that the build is a pump gas build. On multiple occasions on multiple sites.

Its not.

Not that it matters a whole lot (It bothers me).


I take your knowledge on the limits of the D as the best around (as its been proven that you know how tro make power on it).







JD:  Youre a dick  LOL  I kid. I kid

[Joseph Davis]

JD:  Youre a dick  LOL  I kid. I kid

You make a factual, verifiable statement and then you're kidding?  About what?  I'm confused.

[PhilStubbs]

even if he does it with 91 octane and meth injection, its quite a feat. i agree that its not "pump gas" numbers, but its still insane.

either way i am curious to see what happens. i love the little D and i think its awesome when people push them.

[PhilStubbs]

i think more than that. i dont see 700 in his future, but he better make more than 500 with all of that shit he has in the car

[Joseph Davis]

i think more than that. i dont see 700 in his future, but he better make more than 500 with all of that shit he has in the car

+1

[bigdaddyvtec]

i think more than that. i dont see 700 in his future, but he better make more than 500 with all of that shit he has in the car

+1

501 horsepowers

On the meth I can see 575 MAYBE 6, I just dont see 700 WHP

[QikEnuF]

He will make 400whp on 66% throttle.

[ratcityrex]

I dont ever think about power at the crank, because 90% of the people when you talk about power think of at the wheels. On that note I think he will make 700 crank hp. If the jfk and his crew did 609, i think fizzy will make it. The only thing I see with his problem (like JD said) it the 9:XX.1 compression. I feel that the reason that the vitaras make such great numbers is due to the low comp. The reason hes staying quite about the whole thing is he just got raped online and he knows where his place is in the food chain. Im sure he has dynoed his shit and failed on a huge scale, and is now changing everything b4 he post up his numbers.

[snm95ls]

Super Street has coverage on this until March of next year...


Considering the lead times on magazine stories, I am sure it is very close to dyno time or has alreayd been on the dyno.

[crttaz]

Why are you putting an " ' " before Bisi? That's his name, there's nothing before the B.

'Bisi is the proper spelling

About me:
I am 'Bisi, also known as Bisimoto, and Dr. Bisi. Owner and founder of Bisimoto Engineering Inc.

[ratcityrex]

Was the 609 build on pump gas?

I don't believe so.

[Joseph Davis]

There's a reason why everyone ignored D-series as power makers for years, and then with the advent of Vitaras w/ 7.5:1 CR suddenly everyone and their retarded brother can break 400 whp on stock head off their first Crome tune - and have it last a while.  It isn't because Vitaras saved them $300 on the price of pistons or anything. 

Small bore engines like the CR piled on when NA, and they absolutely hate it when breathed on. You can sidestep this to a great extent with an interesting cam, port/valve changes biasing the power upwards in the rpm band and maintaining it there, as well as making it easy for the engine to breathe with a good IM/turbo kit.  But.  The primary limitation, to which everything is secondary, is the bore size which dictates how easy the piston is to push down.  At some point the combustion chamber at TDC is too small to fit any more fuel/air mass and the only thing you can do to make more power is to open it up.  Common 60's V8 knowledge.  Common 20's internal combustion engineering knowledge.

[PhilStubbs]

Was the 609 build on pump gas?

no

[patsmx5]

There's a reason why everyone ignored D-series as power makers for years, and then with the advent of Vitaras w/ 7.5:1 CR suddenly everyone and their retarded brother can break 400 whp on stock head off their first Crome tune - and have it last a while.  It isn't because Vitaras saved them $300 on the price of pistons or anything. 

Small bore engines like the CR piled on when NA, and they absolutely hate it when breathed on. You can sidestep this to a great extent with an interesting cam, port/valve changes biasing the power upwards in the rpm band and maintaining it there, as well as making it easy for the engine to breathe with a good IM/turbo kit.  But.  The primary limitation, to which everything is secondary, is the bore size which dictates how easy the piston is to push down.  At some point the combustion chamber at TDC is too small to fit any more fuel/air mass and the only thing you can do to make more power is to open it up.  Common 60's V8 knowledge.  Common 20's internal combustion engineering knowledge.

That's just ridiculous.

[JFK78]

Why are you putting an " ' " before Bisi? That's his name, there's nothing before the B.

But explain then, why Bisi said that it was a "hoax" to hurt his business after speaking with you? I find it insulting that he doesn't even show real concern about peoples bad experiences, instead dismisses it as "hating".

As for the pump thing, he doesn't actually mention the use of meth injection, instead only posts pictures and advertises his build as making 700hp on pump. Nothing more, nothing less. He leaves out little, but important, details about certain things which can be, and usually are, misleading to the public.

There is a " ' " before, that's why I put it there. 'Bisi is an abbreviation of his full name.

I'm not here to defend 'Bisi and his business, that's not my job. I just came on here to share my personal experience with him and my viewpoint on the whole thing.

I disagree on the "pump gas" thing completely. From what I've seen, many have read the words "unleaded fuel" and immediately assumed 91-94oct. pump gas and then went on about that.

From what I have seen/read, the build is titled "QUEST FOR 700hp". That means it is a goal he is shooting for with this build, whether it happens or not. He clearly stated many times that it would utilize unleaded fuel and water-meth injection. He also stated that he would change things in the setup as needed to help achieve his goal.

UNLEADED FUEL encompasses alot more choices than just pump gas. I think everyone has been missing that and the fact that it's just a goal, if it doesn't happen that's OK. It's still gonna make big power. 

I have no idea who you are but that right there sounds like ass kissing.  You sao "if you made more power after a cam change then so be it" well isn't that the point . there shouldn't be massive gains by switching to a new cam, this is a performance cam...... 

and on a side not NO ONE has touched on the fucked graphs he posts. Yeah no big deal right?

Call it what you will. Once again, I'm not here to defend 'Bisi and his business, that's not my job. I just came on here to share my personal experience with him and my viewpoint on the whole thing.

I take this cam thing with a grain of salt, because I haven't had a bad experience. We have all seen plenty of builds with good cams in them not perform due to some other flaw in the combination while others utilizing the same cams excel. Point being, I think people tend to immediately blame the Bisimoto cam if they have one because they feel it's a magic bullet. Just like any part, it may work well for some and not so well for others. 'Bisi is just an easy target because he is such a public figure. If you bash on Crower or Skunk2, etc. there's no face to the name.

As far as some of the graphs he posts, they may seem odd but I don't think he fabricated them. It may just be a worst case scenario that he tuned and it made those huge gains, so he posted it. I don't know. 

It's also a recreational impossibility.  I can see making a large (100-125 whp) increase in knock limit over popularly "understood" limits by increasing head flow and raising the point at which the engine makes and carries torque efficiently, but you're not hitting 700whp (in anything that traps like 700whp) with unleaded gasoline as your primary fuel.  Here are my points:

- Stock injectors for gasoline and big secondaries for methanol, ok, but conventional water/meth results in a 15% increase in knock limit.  On a conventional gasoline D16 with water/diluent injection, non injected 325 whp --> water/meth injected 375 whp for a stock cam/port car.  You can even break 400 by a bit if you aren't alarmed by the engine's timing requirement dropping off like a stone because it's at the edge of knock and the gasoline is volatile.  Add in some big port/valve mojo and a good cam and I can see brushing against 500-550 and it might even brush 500 on a heartbreaker Mustang dyno with corrections not applied. 

- Dynamic compression ratio is an interesting thing, but the static rating of 9:1 is still a primary factor.  You have to have a combustion chamber big enough to support the fuel/air mass that is burning inside of it and 9:1 on a small bore motor is pretty limiting.  Period.  End of story.  Argue with Ricardo or Vizard or God Almighty.

Anyway, I can appreciate your point on everything else, James, and thank you for tossing it in.  I'm glad that a lot of the 1.2's are working correctly for you and therefore others, but I know that there is a problem with them/some of them whether it's caused by an error in Bisi's design, an error at Web during grinding, etc. 

JD, thanks for the education on water-meth injection. I personally have no experience with it. Your arguement here seems logical against straight pump gas. But based on my comments above regarding the use of unleaded fuel and the other options that includes, do you think it's feasable on say the Torco 108 unleaded?

I have respect for you James, all of you guys are good to me... and in no way am I pointing any kind of finger, but to clear something up... He does indeed portray that the build is a pump gas build. On multiple occasions on multiple sites.

Its not.

Not that it matters a whole lot (It bothers me).


I take your knowledge on the limits of the D as the best around (as its been proven that you know how tro make power on it).

Thanks Spiker. I never got that impression anywhere in anything printed in the magazine articles/forums or out of 'Bisi's mouth. All I read was "unleaded fuel" and the intended use of water-meth injection to try and reach a 700hp goal, and that changes would be made if needed to try and achieve it.

[danz]

I don't even know most of the guys making the comments and as far as Danz is concerned, he already posted his experience and opinions plenty of times, I don't feel the need to rehash it.

As far his turbo cams for D-series, I have tuned a few cars with the 1.2 cam, and they all seemed to make a little more power than a stock cam, carrying power a bit better than a stock cam. This is what I would expect from a mild cam. Danz car was the worst result I've seen, but I don't normally deal with the non-vtec variants and felt that there were other contributing factors to the poor results. If he then retuned with another cam that worked better on his setup with no other changes, then so be it.

when i got home from tacoma, i changed my head gasket, put new arp head studs in, and put on a stock head port matched to the Z6 intake manifold (oh and a new VC gasket, sorry about that james!!!). i ran the car like this with the tune i had, managed to run 11.79 after about 30 passes of tinkering.  from that moment onward the only change i made to the car was the Colt cam. 

NOW I MUST BE CLEAR:

there was a miscommunication between bisi and i.  the 1.2 was too mild for my goals.  i should have done more research into what other products would have been better suited to my application.  i cant blame bisi for that, and i wont, because its my fault.

its a known fact the 2.4 works well.  and the 3.6 seems to work pretty fuckin decent too.

I take this cam thing with a grain of salt, because I haven't had a bad experience. We have all seen plenty of builds with good cams in them not perform due to some other flaw in the combination while others utilizing the same cams excel. Point being, I think people tend to immediately blame the Bisimoto cam if they have one because they feel it's a magic bullet. Just like any part, it may work well for some and not so well for others.

true, i had VERY high expectations from my cam.  too high, i believe.   i really should have gone for a larger cam right off the bat.  and i cant truly blame bisi for not giving me a free cam 10 months after i bought mine... the idea is cool but its not very realistic.



anyways fuck all this bullshit.  i think the 1.22 cam would be a sick little fucker on a GT28 setup.  like woah, son.  like woah.

let it be known, im a fuck up.  my penis is small, and my face looks slightly retarded.  but not in a downs syndrome type of way, more like an autistic type of way

[PhilStubbs]

i was under the impression it was a pump gas goal, as in 91-93 octane. after people started doubting him, i did see him say "unleaded fuel" rather than pump gas.

the way i look at it, if you cant drive your car to the pump, put your credit card in and fill up, its not pump gas.

i am in no way a Bisi hater. i was excited when i first saw this. there just seems to be some back peddaling.

[92CXyD]

Some stations in Cali and Ontario (and I'm sure other places too) have 100 octane pump gas.

I would love to have 100 octane fuel in my area.

I have to order from Denver c16 or the like to get any good fuel.

[PhilStubbs]

Some stations in Cali and Ontario (and I'm sure other places too) have 100 octane pump gas.

i think i would be ok calling that pump gas, seeeing that there is a sunoco near me that has it too

[Robb]

I dont even care about the dude's build.  700hp. Ok.  Whatever.

The nutswingers over there make me wanna puke.  Id rather be driving a slow pos than all up on his shit. 

On a side note, does anybody else find the VW banner ad as funny and ironic as I do? Maybe its just me. 

[97Econobox]

Some stations in Cali and Ontario (and I'm sure other places too) have 100 octane pump gas.

i think i would be ok calling that pump gas, seeeing that there is a sunoco near me that has it too

There arent any pump gas stations here in VA with that.  we have Cam 2 and full on race gas at teh pump in very select places.  But as far as Im concerned 91\93 is pump.  anything else or more is not pump.  few places have anythign more than 91\92 on pump gerneraly speaking.

[bigdaddyvtec]

Ya man no shot I'm with that.101unleaded is racegas. Jesus. What's so Fucking hard to grasp....  if you can't get it at your local corner gas station of the big three..87 89 and whatever the premium rating is its not fucking pumpgas per say by any halfway realistic person

[bigdaddyvtec]

I'll add this he says I'm his posts that this is a street cat and be wants it to ne a true street car that runs readily available fuel. We have 101 on a couple places here... trick 101  .  It's not readily available here... so I know god dam well it isnt there.

Whatever.

[random-strike]

when you read 92 on the pump, that just means it can be up to 92. it doesn't mean that it is always 92 octane.

[PhilStubbs]

do they have e85 out there? that might be a solution around the problem

[92CXyD]

when you read 92 on the pump, that just means it can be up to 92. it doesn't mean that it is always 92 octane.

92 on pump means at least 92, can not be below 92.

Here in Wyoming the fuel is checked regularly by the State Ag. department.
I talked to the guys that test the fuel and they said it can be over the rating but not under.

We have a branch of stations that use to put water in their 10% ethonal fuel and got caught.
But they still do it occasionally.

Which sucks if you own any vehicles with paper element in the fuel filter (i.e. GM with fram G3727 and equivalent).
Water gets in them and the paper element swells up and blocks off the fuel flow.

[patsmx5]

A good fuel filter will stop water. You always run a fine micron filter on a diesel for this reason, cause usually it's better to kill the engine from lack of fuel and have to change the fuel filter then to get water in the injection system.

[Robb]

do they have e85 out there? that might be a solution around the problem

E85 is actually E70 in the winter.  Re-tune is a good idea.  

I prefer the E85 route myself.  Keep it simple.

[random-strike]

when you read 92 on the pump, that just means it can be up to 92. it doesn't mean that it is always 92 octane.

92 on pump means at least 92, can not be below 92.

Here in Wyoming the fuel is checked regularly by the State Ag. department.
I talked to the guys that test the fuel and they said it can be over the rating but not under.

We have a branch of stations that use to put water in their 10% ethonal fuel and got caught.
But they still do it occasionally.

Which sucks if you own any vehicles with paper element in the fuel filter (i.e. GM with fram G3727 and equivalent).
Water gets in them and the paper element swells up and blocks off the fuel flow.

you are right i got it ass backwards

[Random Hero]

ride SF's dick spiker riiiddddee!!! 



nigger


*edit*

I didn't do much but skim through this post. But isn't this engine getting dyno'd on an engine dyno? so 700hp isnt that unrealistic if you think he can make 575whp.