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[Joseph Davis]

BTW, I intend to buy one of these, verify it doesn't suck shit through a straw by comparing it to my PLX M250 and NGK AFX (which read the same as each other across years and sensors at low load, with a carved in stone split under load on certain vehicles), and then use it for a wideband leanburn closed loop so I can save mpgs when I drive to and from your mom's house to fuck her.

[PhilStubbs]

Will that happen in the same timeframe as the 14point7 wideband? If so I'm holding my breath in anticipation. see you guys in hell!!! 

[jabberwock]

[NoPistons!]

They ship fast as fuck.  JD, my mum prolly would enjoy it.  Want her cell number?  Also i know you make your bread of your rep as a tuner.  Nothing but respect.  I'm just a hobbyist fucking around.  I do get paid to work on cars and shit but it's nothing fancy.  Again, just a hobby.

For the record, fuck aem.  I've been on that tip ever since the $200 cold air intake was invented.   I hear alot of mixed things about their wideband especially and opted to stay the hell away from it.  Lot of nissan "tuners" told me "it's the best one you can get" and i didn't even respect that opinion with a response.















Word.  As soon as customer car leaves my driveway and is paid for it's on to testing.

[92CXyD]

Looking forward to seeing the results. 

[NoPistons!]

I should be able to get a safe tune out of it.  Have nothing to compare it against but if JD picks one up and puts it up against the baller units that might let you know where this thing stands.  I'd wait on his results.

[PhilStubbs]

If I get one, I'll log it against my LM2 and post results. I have way too much shit going on right now to bother though.

[Joseph Davis]

Will that happen in the same timeframe as the 14point7 wideband? If so I'm holding my breath in anticipation. see you guys in hell!!! 

It's been installed in a friend's car for a little over a year.  Great part throttle accuracy, read .3-.4 richer than my "trusted" Bosch units (8 year old PLX, LM-2, both of which always agree with each other) and with the accepted split at WOT with regard to the NTK sensors, and above all the unit consistently reads the same thing.  I'd need to see 6-8 more to get a feel for how accurate they are overall, but Alan To > shit sourced from china by a disreputable company known for glitchy product sooooo I expect they all read the same.

They ship fast as fuck.  JD, my mum prolly would enjoy it.  Want her cell number?  Also i know you make your bread of your rep as a tuner.  Nothing but respect.  I'm just a hobbyist fucking around.  I do get paid to work on cars and shit but it's nothing fancy.  Again, just a hobby.

Which is why I offer feedback.  Nothing worse than watching someone bright enough to have a good time, and reasonable success, rolling their own fall on their face because the general forum consensus is to buy garbage product that doesn't work.

And, PM mom's number.  I'll pee in her butt.

[92CXyD]

Will that happen in the same timeframe as the 14point7 wideband? If so I'm holding my breath in anticipation. see you guys in hell!!! 

It's been installed in a friend's car for a little over a year.  Great part throttle accuracy, read .3-.4 richer than my "trusted" Bosch units (8 year old PLX, LM-2, both of which always agree with each other) and with the accepted split at WOT with regard to the NTK sensors, and above all the unit consistently reads the same thing.  I'd need to see 6-8 more to get a feel for how accurate they are overall, but Alan To > shit sourced from china by a disreputable company known for glitchy product sooooo I expect they all read the same.

They ship fast as fuck.  JD, my mum prolly would enjoy it.  Want her cell number?  Also i know you make your bread of your rep as a tuner.  Nothing but respect.  I'm just a hobbyist fucking around.  I do get paid to work on cars and shit but it's nothing fancy.  Again, just a hobby.

Which is why I offer feedback.  Nothing worse than watching someone bright enough to have a good time, and reasonable success, rolling their own fall on their face because the general forum consensus is to buy garbage product that doesn't work.

And, PM mom's number.  I'll pee in her butt.

I have a 14point7 and compared to the used UEGO AEM gauge it is way better. Also it has provisions of datalogging, and display options are plentiful.

And I agree Alan To's shit > CDM & AEM crap

No incite on other than Bosch O2s, but 17014s work fine for me so far. 

[PhilStubbs]

That is the first indication I have ever seen that you had your hands on one. Good to know.

[rawr]

checking it against another sensor is kinda ghetto. I can do it by electrical simulation on a 5520A if someone sends me one to check.

[NoPistons!]

True but stuffing multiple sensors in the exhaust with multiple gauges on the dyno wouldn't be a bad idea at all.


Edit:  Real time logging of all data on all sensors on a control car would yield the results everyone's after.  Seeing JD post about wideband accuracy in another thread made me wonder and why NOT pit all the widebands on the market against one another to see what's the most bang for the buck.  Very good topic!

Also, in hindsight i kinda wished i had just stuffed the 14point7, innovate LC-1 and the bpsx on a car, put a camera on all 3 gauges and did a pull.  There's several local turbo cars (guy down the street as an evo and 1st gen dsm with a massive fmic and 20g, dude about 5 min's away has a fully built ls dc4 teg. Guy who works at the plant next door to mine turbocharged his rsx.  Not much done tot he outside.  He has to share a parking lot with ricers.  He's got a clean carbon gt wing and a lip kit with stock wheels and lowering springs. There's 2 eg coups in town that are clean enough to eat off of.  One turbocharged and the exhaust is quiet as a mouse.  He wont pop his hood.  =(  And at the bank a couple months ago i saw a turbocharged dc4 weathered to shit, and mostly stock.  Quiet but had a thick older tube and fin fmic (looked like the older hks, spearco and greddy cores.  not no cdm or junkyard stuff) and the grill cut out the bumper. Everyone else is pretty much a bullshitting ricer.  I can't list what but he does have alot of aem shit including ems and wideband.  I dont even want to know how much he's spent on that thing.  Friend of mine knows them.  I dont. I'll get on it though and see if we can't get everyone together.  It's crazy all the tuners are disbanded in a place where v8's and turbo diesels are pretty much owning it.   I hang out with what's left of my old skater/bmx clique....the ones that didn't do things to cause a drastic course of life change in a negative direction anyway.....  We're all too sore to smash our bodies into the ground, stairs, handrails, walls going 20mph anymore so are cars the next best thing.  I also know of a dyno within 35 minutes drive. 

Can't make any promises but i'll do what i can.   I work 12 days a month.  The rest?  I have some free time. 

[Joseph Davis]

checking it against another sensor is kinda ghetto. I can do it by electrical simulation on a 5520A if someone sends me one to check.

No.

[rawr]

checking it against another sensor is kinda ghetto. I can do it by electrical simulation on a 5520A if someone sends me one to check.

No.

fu

[PhilStubbs]

I see no better way to compare them than on a car data logging with graphs.

[rawr]

[rawr]

Doing it with a synthesized signal is the best. comparing against another sensor with the same accuracy in an unregulated envrionment ( even having them close together is not going to be effective). With a 5520 and a 3458 (Both are NIST traceable and A2LA acred) would get by doing it sensor to sensor.


trust it nagger

fat fingering my stupid phone on an edit.

[Ntrain2k]

True but stuffing multiple sensors in the exhaust with multiple gauges on the dyno wouldn't be a bad idea at all.


Edit:  Real time logging of all data on all sensors on a control car would yield the results everyone's after.  Seeing JD post about wideband accuracy in another thread made me wonder and why NOT pit all the widebands on the market against one another to see what's the most bang for the buck.  Very good topic!

Also, in hindsight i kinda wished i had just stuffed the 14point7, innovate LC-1 and the bpsx on a car, put a camera on all 3 gauges and did a pull.  There's several local turbo cars (guy down the street as an evo and 1st gen dsm with a massive fmic and 20g, dude about 5 min's away has a fully built ls dc4 teg. Guy who works at the plant next door to mine turbocharged his rsx.  Not much done tot he outside.  He has to share a parking lot with ricers.  He's got a clean carbon gt wing and a lip kit with stock wheels and lowering springs. There's 2 eg coups in town that are clean enough to eat off of.  One turbocharged and the exhaust is quiet as a mouse.  He wont pop his hood.  =(  And at the bank a couple months ago i saw a turbocharged dc4 weathered to shit, and mostly stock.  Quiet but had a thick older tube and fin fmic (looked like the older hks, spearco and greddy cores.  not no cdm or junkyard stuff) and the grill cut out the bumper. Everyone else is pretty much a bullshitting ricer.  I can't list what but he does have alot of aem shit including ems and wideband.  I dont even want to know how much he's spent on that thing.  Friend of mine knows them.  I dont. I'll get on it though and see if we can't get everyone together.  It's crazy all the tuners are disbanded in a place where v8's and turbo diesels are pretty much owning it.   I hang out with what's left of my old skater/bmx clique....the ones that didn't do things to cause a drastic course of life change in a negative direction anyway.....  We're all too sore to smash our bodies into the ground, stairs, handrails, walls going 20mph anymore so are cars the next best thing.  I also know of a dyno within 35 minutes drive. 

Can't make any promises but i'll do what i can.   I work 12 days a month.  The rest?  I have some free time. 

We will be having the RHMT/TT.net dyno day soon. If a few widebands were to be there it would be a good time to run them against each other.

[PhilStubbs]

I have a demon, I could log at least 5 widebands at the same time on the same car. Might need an external power source to heat all 5 sensors though. Lol

[92CXyD]

True but stuffing multiple sensors in the exhaust with multiple gauges on the dyno wouldn't be a bad idea at all.


Edit:  Real time logging of all data on all sensors on a control car would yield the results everyone's after.  Seeing JD post about wideband accuracy in another thread made me wonder and why NOT pit all the widebands on the market against one another to see what's the most bang for the buck.  Very good topic!

Also, in hindsight i kinda wished i had just stuffed the 14point7, innovate LC-1 and the bpsx on a car, put a camera on all 3 gauges and did a pull.  There's several local turbo cars (guy down the street as an evo and 1st gen dsm with a massive fmic and 20g, dude about 5 min's away has a fully built ls dc4 teg. Guy who works at the plant next door to mine turbocharged his rsx.  Not much done tot he outside.  He has to share a parking lot with ricers.  He's got a clean carbon gt wing and a lip kit with stock wheels and lowering springs. There's 2 eg coups in town that are clean enough to eat off of.  One turbocharged and the exhaust is quiet as a mouse.  He wont pop his hood.  =(  And at the bank a couple months ago i saw a turbocharged dc4 weathered to shit, and mostly stock.  Quiet but had a thick older tube and fin fmic (looked like the older hks, spearco and greddy cores.  not no cdm or junkyard stuff) and the grill cut out the bumper. Everyone else is pretty much a bullshitting ricer.  I can't list what but he does have alot of aem shit including ems and wideband.  I dont even want to know how much he's spent on that thing.  Friend of mine knows them.  I dont. I'll get on it though and see if we can't get everyone together.  It's crazy all the tuners are disbanded in a place where v8's and turbo diesels are pretty much owning it.   I hang out with what's left of my old skater/bmx clique....the ones that didn't do things to cause a drastic course of life change in a negative direction anyway.....  We're all too sore to smash our bodies into the ground, stairs, handrails, walls going 20mph anymore so are cars the next best thing.  I also know of a dyno within 35 minutes drive. 

Can't make any promises but i'll do what i can.   I work 12 days a month.  The rest?  I have some free time. 

We will be having the RHMT/TT.net dyno day soon. If a few widebands were to be there it would be a good time to run them against each other.

That be awesome if some research done at these dyno meets. 

[rawr]

Face palm.

[Minor Threat]

I am enjoying the fact that rawr is distressed by people wanting to test things outside of a lab.

[NoPistons!]

It's a good idea to do both. 

[PhilStubbs]

Considering they are being tested in the exact manner they will be used, it seems perfect to me.

[rawr]

its like checking a bunch of micrometers against each other on a piece of foam that you checked with a ruler. You will get results but basically you will just be verifying that something works, not that it is accurate and assuming the more expensive piece of hardware is functioning perfectly.


It doesn't need to be done in a lab, you can do it at home with a like fluke 87 and any power supply thatch flat enough to use and had its output monitored before the test.    -

[Minor Threat]

its like checking a bunch of micrometers against each other on a piece of foam that you checked with a ruler. You will get results but basically you will just be verifying that something works, not that it is accurate and assuming the more expensive piece of hardware is functioning perfectly.


It doesn't need to be done in a lab, you can do it at home with a like fluke 87 and any power supply thatch flat enough to use and had its output monitored before the test.    -

If it's being compared against a unit that's known to be good i.e. JD's trusty PLX/Bosch combo, it'd be more like "Here is a micrometer that measures accurately enough so it can tell me if this part is within spec and will fit in the hole, let's check these other micrometers we're not sure of and see if the measurement is the same." Does it matter if the original micrometer is out by a few thou compared to what the true (read: lab) measurement is? Nope. Doesn't matter.

[rawr]

Ok. I understand that you dont care if your shit sucks. 


Why are you so butthurt over me saying id check shit for free in a lab using the correct method and accredited, nist traceable standards? Isnt checking one piece of hardware and assuming the rest are ok ghetto enough for you? We might find out something like the 50 dollar piece of hardware, when isolated from a sensor is more accurate than an lc1. Something you would never have the posibility of knowing doing it the wrong way.

[Minor Threat]

I'm not butthurt, I'm just tired of having you come into every thread about anything sensor related yammering about lab this, lab that, like it's impossible to conduct any meaningful testing in the real world.

If you're all about helping advance tech available, quit asking someone to send you free stuff, spend 50 dollars (you drive a gaybar still right? so you have the sensor) and DIY.

 The rest of us will compare things to shit we know works empirically and it will be good enough for 99% of this site.

[PhilStubbs]

Considering that this group of people originally came together with HF manifolds, 14b turbos and dsm side mount intercoolers mounted in Hondas. We will test our equipment the same way. I wasn't knocking the lab, but it seems overkill. Plus we get to use a cars charging system which is how the unit will be used.

[Joseph Davis]

I'm not butthurt, I'm just tired of having you come into every thread about anything sensor related yammering about lab this, lab that, like it's impossible to conduct any meaningful testing in the real world.

If you're all about helping advance tech available, quit asking someone to send you free stuff, spend 50 dollars (you drive a gaybar still right? so you have the sensor) and DIY.

 The rest of us will compare things to shit we know works empirically and it will be good enough for 99% of this site.

Caleb's method is correct, I just like giving him hell.

And, he's not asking for free shit.  He's saying he'll cal your shit for free, so everyone knows what it really is/does, which is a service that companies pay $50-thousands for depending on what it is. 

You may not like the guy, but he cals shit for nuclear reactors, and NASA.  I don't particularly care for Passenger and how he doesn't have a corncob stuffed up his ass - it's the entire corn field - but I STFU and listen when he talks about what he knows.  Get over your dislike and listen, Brett.