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[Eggylshatch]

Johnny, my name is Evan.  Do you even know what communism is?

[random-strike]

Without the Russian government where would you get AKMs?  I wish I could live in johnny's imaginary world in his fortress of solitude.

i'd have a different rifle.

Johnny, my name is Evan.  Do you even know what communism is?

you = owned. government LEECH

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Without the Russian government where would you get AKMs?  I wish I could live in johnny's imaginary world in his fortress of solitude.

Without organization none of this shit we're talking about would even exist.  No internet, no guns, nothing!  We would be chasing shit with sticks and drawing pictures in caves.

there can be organization without government, and it would be voluntary and not forced.

you can't really believe that without government there would not be guns or internet, or anything else.

making a single shot rifle is quite simple and can be done with simple machinery.

if you really believe that the world would go back to the stone aged without government, you will be a slave your entire life, and have no hope of ever being free

[random-strike]

you guys can have and pay for your government, i'll have and pay for mine. wouldn't that make you happy? i would be happy with that...

but of course, that wouldn't work... because you can't pay for your government, you have to forced other people to.

[Eggylshatch]

Free market and trade can't really happen without government, and more specifically democratic government.  I'm saying 99.9% of the world would live in extreme poverty without the structure government provides, and technology wouldn't be available to you.  And religion was and has always been the basis of most of the world's atrocities.  Hence the attempt to separate religion and state in our Constitution.  

Back on topic:

Your kids probably already receive a sub-par education, but it would be MUCH worse if there wasn't government standards and intervention.  Can you really debate that?

[Eggylshatch]

Without the Russian government where would you get AKMs?  I wish I could live in johnny's imaginary world in his fortress of solitude.

i'd have a different rifle.

Johnny, my name is Evan.  Do you even know what communism is?

you = owned. government LEECH

I think you should talk to someone living in Afghanistan, where religion is the main power, people fear for their lives and well-being on a daily basis, and they would give anything for the opportunities and standard of living we have in our country.  You blindly rebel against something you have no real concept of.  I can't blame you too much, its natural to fear that which you do not know.  Sorry Johnny, but you're the sheep.  Bred to stupidity, and so blinded that you adamantly support the same ideas that keep you dumb and blind.

[random-strike]

Free market and trade can't really happen without government, and more specifically democratic government.  I'm saying 99.9% of the world would live in extreme poverty without the structure government provides, and technology wouldn't be available to you.  And religion was and has always been the basis of most of the world's atrocities.  Hence the attempt to separate religion and state in our Constitution.  

Back on topic:

Your kids probably already receive a sub-par education, but it would be MUCH worse if there wasn't government standards and intervention.  Can you really debate that?

free market and trade can happen without government, because if i don't agree with what a company does i won't buy anything from them.

government produces monopolies. a monopoly is not possible without government. all the monopolies today are created by government.

yes i can certainly argue that. because with the money i waste paying for your government, i could hire someone to teach them.

the separation of church and state is not in our constitution. and the doctrine of s of c&s in the context of the united states came about in an attempt to protect individual liberty (which you hate) not because they thought religion was evil. you are sadly misinformed.

educating is always better when controlled at the local level.

you can always teach your kids yourself.

The concept of separating church and state is often credited to the writings of English philosopher John Locke.[3] According to his principle of the social contract, Locke argued that the government lacked authority in the realm of individual conscience, as this was something rational people could not cede to the government for it or others to control. For Locke, this created a natural right in the liberty of conscience, which he argued must therefore remain protected from any government authority. These views on religious tolerance and the importance of individual conscience, along with his social contract, became particularly influential in the American colonies and the drafting of the United States Constitution.

[random-strike]

Without the Russian government where would you get AKMs?  I wish I could live in johnny's imaginary world in his fortress of solitude.

i'd have a different rifle.

Johnny, my name is Evan.  Do you even know what communism is?

you = owned. government LEECH

I think you should talk to someone living in Afghanistan, where religion is the main power, people fear for their lives and well-being on a daily basis, and they would give anything for the opportunities and standard of living we have in our country.  You blindly rebel against something you have no real concept of.  I can't blame you too much, its natural to fear that which you do not know.  Sorry Johnny, but you're the sheep.  Bred to stupidity, and so blinded that you adamantly support the same ideas that keep you dumb and blind.

we had a better standard of living in the unites states in 1780 than afgan has now, and it has nothing to do with religion. it has to do with people, and the government being out of our hair (up until the last 100 years). religion has no power without government. they formed an authoritarian government that uses religion to control people.

you are a sheep. baaa baaaaaaa baaaaaaaaaaaaaa. without government you would be dead. pathetic.

[ryan89crx]

I love how Johnny's arguments are 90% namecalling, 9% conspiracy theory, and 1% common sense

[random-strike]

You honestly think you would have a different rifle?  Which government would commission the R&D for that rifle?  Oh right someone would research on their own to develop the muzzle loader, then be killed and someone would take that muzzle loader and R&D off that then they die.  How would you mass produce and sell something like this?  Oh I'm sorry, even the term sell implies some kind of universal currency by which we trade goods and services.  And even if you could produce copies, in such a wild and crazy environment with no social organization would you even want to sell a copy of your gun?

its really bizarre that you think without government there would be no rifles.

[random-strike]

I love how Johnny's arguments are 90% namecalling, 9% conspiracy theory, and 1% common sense

oh snap. you do exactly what you accuse me of.

clown

[ryan89crx]

I love how Johnny's arguments are 90% namecalling, 9% conspiracy theory, and 1% common sense

oh snap. you do exactly what you accuse me of.

clown

prove it

[random-strike]

I love how Johnny's arguments are 90% namecalling, 9% conspiracy theory, and 1% common sense

oh snap. you do exactly what you accuse me of.

clown

prove it

what do you mean prove it? you did it in your post...

[ryan89crx]

I love how Johnny's arguments are 90% namecalling, 9% conspiracy theory, and 1% common sense

oh snap. you do exactly what you accuse me of.

clown

prove it

what do you mean prove it? you did it in your post...

ok

[random-strike]

You honestly think you would have a different rifle?  Which government would commission the R&D for that rifle?  Oh right someone would research on their own to develop the muzzle loader, then be killed and someone would take that muzzle loader and R&D off that then they die.  How would you mass produce and sell something like this?  Oh I'm sorry, even the term sell implies some kind of universal currency by which we trade goods and services.  And even if you could produce copies, in such a wild and crazy environment with no social organization would you even want to sell a copy of your gun?

its really bizarre that you think without government there would be no rifles.

It's really bizarre that you think the security and funding provided by the government doesn't facilitate research and development.

i never said it didn't. i said its not needed. and its all done by force. if its voluntary. go ahead.

i'd trade retina scanners on doors for freedom any day

[random-strike]

answer my question.

would you agree to a voluntary system, you can pay and use it, someone else can not pay, and not use it if they choose.

would you agree?

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The problem is you wish to not pay and still continue to use it.

you mean like all the people who don't pay and use it now? all the leeches like you senior hot pocket and eggy?

[random-strike]

Get off the internet.  Turn off your lights.  Do not drive your car on public roads.  Do not use anything you have not bartered for.  Do not use money of any sort.  Carve wood with your homemade knife and trade it to someone for food like a fucking Jamacian.

We're talking about "paying" and "using" as general terms of participating in government and society, not specifically welfare.

why? i'd still have to pay for it...

gold and silver have always been "money"

[random-strike]

maybe the world is going to end in 2012 because the govt will finally be bankrupt. and of course without the govt we'd all die and the world would stop.

[random-strike]

Get off the internet.  Turn off your lights.  Do not drive your car on public roads.  Do not use anything you have not bartered for.  Do not use money of any sort.  Carve wood with your homemade knife and trade it to someone for food like a fucking Jamacian.

We're talking about "paying" and "using" as general terms of participating in government and society, not specifically welfare.

ps, what makes you think that i wouldn't pay to use the roads?

[Eggylshatch]

Johnny, your poorly backed and structured arguments are distracting me from my work and thus resulting in me wasting all the money that the government stole from you.  

How do you figure government made monopolies?  It is the government that breaks up monopolies.  Monopolies are formed by greedy individuals seeking greater wealth and power and control over others, the nemesis of freedom.  Let's say that our current state living could magically go one without government.  What would keep enormous corporations from swallowing most of the smaller ones?  And controlling the media (which they mostly do already anyway) to keep you uninformed and ignorant of what is happening?  What keeps the companies from exploiting workers, from exploiting our natural resources, and destroying the environment?  Stripping the common man of basic rights (granted by our former government) such as to clean air and water, all in the name of profit.  The rich get richer, the poor get poorer.  Maybe in your ideal world of 1780, when population density was low and there was still open land to be had you wouldn't have to worry about these things as much, but surprise, theres 6.5 billion people on the planet now, and that number is still going up.  They all want their little piece of happiness, and they'd love to take it from you Johnny.  Government keeps them from doing it.

[random-strike]

can you really be that ignorant?

all your utilities are government created monopolies.
all radio stations
all tv stations that aren't on cable
electricity
sewer
water
your phone service
your cell phone service
oil
gas
natural gas
internet connections

the government creates monopolies by creating protections for companies that give it money.

you can't start a oil company without government approval. you can't start a cell phone service without government approval. you can't start a radio station without government approval.

clean air and water is not a right.

you used to have property rights (you don't now) if a company ruined your property then you can sue them in civil court.

do you think government doesn't pollute and destroy? do you think they don't allow it to certain companies?

by your retarded logic, china should be the cleanest happiest place on earth, the government controls everything there, all the companies there are controlled by the government. its one of the most polluted shit holes on earth. because of government.

if a company (without government protection) was ruining a water supply that a bunch of people used, they'd break out their fucking pitchforks and burn the place to the ground, of course you can't do that now, because government protects and condones those companies.

all the great monopolies you're thinking of in old times were created and condoned by government, standard oil, etc...

[random-strike]

i want a constitutional government. a very small republic.

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http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.244057bd1b30448115575c2187e68681.141&show_article=1

[Jorsher]

I went to a shitty Georgia school in a tiny city that was mostly low-or-no-income people.  We lived in the only nice neighborhood, the school had a small budget but did a decent job of trying to educate the 500 kids in kindergarten-8th.  They moved me to classes a grade level above what I was, and sent our small bunch of gifted kids to cool field trips.

My high school was a public "private" all-magnet school in which you had to be recommended by your middle school teachers and pass an entrance exam.  You were put on probation if you did not maintain a B average.  The school always ranked at the top for schools in the state.  None of the students skipped (it'd actually have an impact on your grade if you did) and everyone got along (there wasn't a single fight in the 3 years I was there).  Virtually everyone graduates with a full scholarship to a number of colleges, and if you didn't you still could depend on the Georgia Hope program which pays for your in-state college as long as you keep a certain GPA.

Senior year I ended up in Alabama, the state that makes education budget cuts so they have enough money for other programs.  I skipped school constantly, slept through all my classes, and still graduated with honors, advanced diploma, blah blah.

School system was decent in Georgia, and sucks complete ass here.  If you don't get a scholarship, you don't have options like the Hope program.  Schools are crowded, and they keep making budget cuts.  Fortunately, they stick by their morals and don't allow the evil lottery here to generate some revenue.

When I lived in Georgia an ad with Georgia students saying "Thank you, Alabama!" in reference to Alabama residents paying for Georgia's education programs by buying lottery tickets.

http://books.google.com/books?id=bq47xduEaGwC&lpg=PA103&ots=c0X3rNh5fK&dq=thank%20you%20alabama%20georgia%20lottery%20commercial&pg=PA99#v=onepage&q=thank%20you%20alabama&f=false

Couldn't find a damn video of it.

[random-strike]

ohhhhhhh won't someone PLEASE THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Stealthmode]

Seriously though, give me one good thing that would come out of the government not having a hand in regulating education.  ONE FUCKING THING.     OK.

Saving $59.2 Billion by getting rid of the Department of Education, who can't (and shouldn't) attempt to control local schools from their koosh offices in DC.

Hey, you can have a public education system, just don't tell me I still have to pay for it if I decide to send my kids to private school (while paying for both). Don't tell me choice and competition is a great thing in healthcare (haha), and refuse to give up the monopoly the government has on schooling. Don't tell me the public school system is the greatest shit ever, then have the President send HIS kids to private school, as well as many other scumbags who force the system on the rest of us. I'd love to throw your socialist ass into a wood chipper. Fucken idiot.

[random-strike]

FACE

[Ravage70]

I see Leean(sp) isn't putting out tonight.
Post pics or it didn't happen.

[Eggylshatch]

Seriously though, give me one good thing that would come out of the government not having a hand in regulating education.  ONE FUCKING THING.     OK.

Saving $59.2 Billion by getting rid of the Department of Education, who can't (and shouldn't) attempt to control local schools from their koosh offices in DC.

Hey, you can have a public education system, just don't tell me I still have to pay for it if I decide to send my kids to private school (while paying for both). Don't tell me choice and competition is a great thing in healthcare (haha), and refuse to give up the monopoly the government has on schooling. Don't tell me the public school system is the greatest shit ever, then have the President send HIS kids to private school, as well as many other scumbags who force the system on the rest of us. I'd love to throw your socialist ass into a wood chipper. Fucken idiot.

The government and the Dept of Education regulate education and set base standards.  The education system is largely run by the states.  If you have a problem, talk to your state senators or (national) senators.  I never said the public school system is the greatest shit ever.  It has more than its fare share of flaws and I've acknowldedged that.  What I said is that there needs to be standards in education.  If you can afford to send your kids to private school fine, send them there, and fist yourself-- and you've got no place in the argument.  I hope they are smart enough and make enough money to support your withered ass someday and throw you in a fucking nursing home.  OK, bitch about paying taxes.  SORRY, EVERYONE does it.  Including my socialist ass.  When you decide to live in this country, you pay taxes for public services, and that includes education.  Like I said, if you have a problem with the rates or paying it, take it up yourself.  The school district decides on the rates, and you can vote.  Go run a campaign fucktard.  You have nice oil lines, but don't call me an idiot, and I'd shove an oil line up your mom's ass before you got me near a wood chipper.

ALRIGHT.  tapping out of this thread.  How bout everyone goes and fucks themselves for a little while.  I'll do the same.