Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

Yes

27 (40.3%)

No

13 (19.4%)

Johnny is an idiot

17 (25.4%)

JDSAP

1 (1.5%)

CRX

7 (10.4%)

LOG

0 (0%)

OCZC

2 (3%)

Total Members Voted: 60

[mandrel-bends]

I don't understand this statement. Wallmart and other discount retail outlets aren't the enemy or the evil empire. I employ 10 people, I see the results of poverty and poor spending habits everyday. If we didn't have discounted retail outlets as a viable option for many of them, their money would go 1/2 to 2/3 as far as it goes now when they don't have enough to begin with. This isn't about wasteful people, this is about poor people trying to make it.  

You are right, China doesn't have to kill American manufacturing, but it is. China is very much capitalizing on Americans wasteful lifestyles. Its not common to buy high quality items anymore, people shop at walmart. It just propagates the already ridiculous American mentality that they can have a lot, for a little.

[Passenger]

I don't understand this statement. Wallmart and other discount retail outlets aren't the enemy or the evil empire. I employ 10 people, I see the results of poverty and poor spending habits everyday. If we didn't have discounted retail outlets as a viable option for many of them, their money would go 1/2 to 2/3 as far as it goes now when they don't have enough to begin with. This isn't about wasteful people, this is about poor people trying to make it.  

You are right, China doesn't have to kill American manufacturing, but it is. China is very much capitalizing on Americans wasteful lifestyles. Its not common to buy high quality items anymore, people shop at walmart. It just propagates the already ridiculous American mentality that they can have a lot, for a little.

And that is where we will differ in opinion. I don't believe in equal opportunity or world peace. And I have had nothing, I've had no money, no resources, lived in barns sheds etc, I never had the expectation that other people should be making things affordable for me.

That doesn't mean I don't want to help people or I believe that people shouldn't help other people.

I think for most of the lower income people I see would greatly benefit from their money not going as far, why do low income people *need* a dvd player, video games, or a chinese turbo kit? Their time would be better spent working to get out of the rut they are in than wasting them on those activities.

[patsmx5]

I don't understand this statement. Wallmart and other discount retail outlets aren't the enemy or the evil empire. I employ 10 people, I see the results of poverty and poor spending habits everyday. If we didn't have discounted retail outlets as a viable option for many of them, their money would go 1/2 to 2/3 as far as it goes now when they don't have enough to begin with. This isn't about wasteful people, this is about poor people trying to make it.  

You are right, China doesn't have to kill American manufacturing, but it is. China is very much capitalizing on Americans wasteful lifestyles. Its not common to buy high quality items anymore, people shop at walmart. It just propagates the already ridiculous American mentality that they can have a lot, for a little.

I think you're missing his point. It's one thing to go to wal-mart and buy some food. If you buy an apple at wal-mart, it's probably as good as any other apple at the local grocery stores. Maybe a little better/worse, depending on what other markets are local. But regardless, the apple is "good" and safe to eat. It's only gonna be around a few days till you eat it anyways.

Now go to walmart and buy something that you plan to keep for years, and expect to work for years, trouble free. Say some type of electronic device, like a 80 dollar stereo. It's shitty when the power button on the stereo becomes troublesome after 2 months of use, and then after a year that button fails and now the stereo won't work at all. But it's not worth fixing, cause is was only 80 bucks new, and for the cost of having someone fix it, you could just "buy another".

That's the mentality that wal-mart and others are making money on.

Truth is, if you couldn't afford the 130 dollar stereo from a known good brand name, then you could have waited till you had enough money saved up to get a good one.

[bigwig]

I don't understand this statement. Wallmart and other discount retail outlets aren't the enemy or the evil empire. I employ 10 people, I see the results of poverty and poor spending habits everyday. If we didn't have discounted retail outlets as a viable option for many of them, their money would go 1/2 to 2/3 as far as it goes now when they don't have enough to begin with. This isn't about wasteful people, this is about poor people trying to make it.  

You are right, China doesn't have to kill American manufacturing, but it is. China is very much capitalizing on Americans wasteful lifestyles. Its not common to buy high quality items anymore, people shop at walmart. It just propagates the already ridiculous American mentality that they can have a lot, for a little.

I think you're missing his point. It's one thing to go to wal-mart and buy some food. If you buy an apple at wal-mart, it's probably as good as any other apple at the local grocery stores. Maybe a little better/worse, depending on what other markets are local. But regardless, the apple is "good" and safe to eat. It's only gonna be around a few days till you eat it anyways.

Now go to walmart and buy something that you plan to keep for years, and expect to work for years, trouble free. Say some type of electronic device, like a 80 dollar stereo. It's shitty when the power button on the stereo becomes troublesome after 2 months of use, and then after a year that button fails and now the stereo won't work at all. But it's not worth fixing, cause is was only 80 bucks new, and for the cost of having someone fix it, you could just "buy another".

That's the mentality that wal-mart and others are making money on.

Truth is, if you couldn't afford the 130 dollar stereo from a known good brand name, then you could have waited till you had enough money saved up to get a good one.

There is something wrong with that example.  Buying a $130 stereo and it breaks in 6 mo. while the $80 one breaks in 6 years.  Why?  Because the $130 "Sony" is the cheapest piece of shit they could possibly make and sucks, while the $80 is some new brand or some Walmart exclusive brand.  In a lot of cases, these brands end up making a solid product for a reasonable price because they are new and want to capture a portion of the business.  I've had that happen to me time and time again.  Walmart is a big powerful corporation for a reason.  They do not invest in companies that are going to end up screwing them over.  Walmart will put you out of business as fast as they helped your business grow.

I think the real comparison is when something was once made in America or a country that gives a shit about how they make/manufacture stuff vs else where.  It's all about a reference point.  These third world countries live in shit.  They know shit.  If you show them anything better, in comparison, it's A LOT better.  As a result, their understanding of nice good work is completely different than those who are used to our standard of things.

I recognize this all the time with FOB immigrants from India, Pakistan, Mexico, ect ect ect.  They don't want to do lack luster work.  They think what they are doing is the right thing.  But by American standards, it's just not good work.

[patsmx5]

I don't understand this statement. Wallmart and other discount retail outlets aren't the enemy or the evil empire. I employ 10 people, I see the results of poverty and poor spending habits everyday. If we didn't have discounted retail outlets as a viable option for many of them, their money would go 1/2 to 2/3 as far as it goes now when they don't have enough to begin with. This isn't about wasteful people, this is about poor people trying to make it.  

You are right, China doesn't have to kill American manufacturing, but it is. China is very much capitalizing on Americans wasteful lifestyles. Its not common to buy high quality items anymore, people shop at walmart. It just propagates the already ridiculous American mentality that they can have a lot, for a little.

I think you're missing his point. It's one thing to go to wal-mart and buy some food. If you buy an apple at wal-mart, it's probably as good as any other apple at the local grocery stores. Maybe a little better/worse, depending on what other markets are local. But regardless, the apple is "good" and safe to eat. It's only gonna be around a few days till you eat it anyways.

Now go to walmart and buy something that you plan to keep for years, and expect to work for years, trouble free. Say some type of electronic device, like a 80 dollar stereo. It's shitty when the power button on the stereo becomes troublesome after 2 months of use, and then after a year that button fails and now the stereo won't work at all. But it's not worth fixing, cause is was only 80 bucks new, and for the cost of having someone fix it, you could just "buy another".

That's the mentality that wal-mart and others are making money on.

Truth is, if you couldn't afford the 130 dollar stereo from a known good brand name, then you could have waited till you had enough money saved up to get a good one.

There is something wrong with that example.  Buying a $130 stereo and it breaks in 6 mo. while the $80 one breaks in 6 years.  Why?  Because the $130 "Sony" is the cheapest piece of shit they could possibly make and sucks, while the $80 is some new brand or some Walmart exclusive brand.  In a lot of cases, these brands end up making a solid product for a reasonable price because they are new and want to capture a portion of the business.  I've had that happen to me time and time again.  Walmart is a big powerful corporation for a reason.  They do not invest in companies that are going to end up screwing them over.  Walmart will put you out of business as fast as they helped your business grow.

I think the real comparison is when something was once made in America or a country that gives a shit about how they make/manufacture stuff vs else where.  It's all about a reference point.  These third world countries live in shit.  They know shit.  If you show them anything better, in comparison, it's A LOT better.  As a result, their understanding of nice good work is completely different than those who are used to our standard of things.

I recognize this all the time with FOB immigrants from India, Pakistan, Mexico, ect ect ect.  They don't want to do lack luster work.  They think what they are doing is the right thing.  But by American standards, it's just not good work.

haaha. I'll agree sony sucks. I said a known good brand, not shitty made in china special. I think you know what I meant by the example I gave. There's exceptions to everything, but IMO, the rule is you get what you pay for most of the time. Especially with electronics. A new company could just as well have good intentions of making a new product that's cheap and very well designed, but it fails after a while from something unforeseen. From the new company not having years of experience making/designing whatever they just released. Or it could be the best thing in the world. There's no rule.

[dvst8r]

Money doesn't solve money problems, it may cover up the symptoms but it doesn't fix them.

[Joseph Davis]

I don't understand this statement. Wallmart and other discount retail outlets aren't the enemy or the evil empire. I employ 10 people, I see the results of poverty and poor spending habits everyday. If we didn't have discounted retail outlets as a viable option for many of them, their money would go 1/2 to 2/3 as far as it goes now when they don't have enough to begin with. This isn't about wasteful people, this is about poor people trying to make it.  

You are right, China doesn't have to kill American manufacturing, but it is. China is very much capitalizing on Americans wasteful lifestyles. Its not common to buy high quality items anymore, people shop at walmart. It just propagates the already ridiculous American mentality that they can have a lot, for a little.

And that is where we will differ in opinion. I don't believe in equal opportunity or world peace. And I have had nothing, I've had no money, no resources, lived in barns sheds etc, I never had the expectation that other people should be making things affordable for me.

That doesn't mean I don't want to help people or I believe that people shouldn't help other people.

I think for most of the lower income people I see would greatly benefit from their money not going as far, why do low income people *need* a dvd player, video games, or a chinese turbo kit? Their time would be better spent working to get out of the rut they are in than wasting them on those activities.

This.

The whole concept that we need immediate gratification, deserve inflated wages despite having less work ethic or truly specialized skills than the average illegal immigrant, and need lots of time off with which to sit on couches and grow fat and self important is false.  Money is the prerogative of those who actually work, which by it's very definition is not easy.

People bitch about the price of college; I paid tuition and books for two years cash out of pocket because I was full time employed, making Dean's and President's List the whole way.  The majority of Americans just can't sacrifice that much time away from prime time television, and firmly believe that there is something fundamentally wrong with America because they can't "afford" to go to school while financing out cars, big screen TVs, iPods and iPhones and a thousand thousand manufactured distractions.  It's crap.

[DmC]

I agree with both of you. Most of the people who have had me tune their cars for them had no financial business owning a turbo car. They have to wait a week or two just to pay me a few hundred to tune the piece for them. They generally have no clue how a turbo works or how to fix it.
I think everyone here will agree owning a turbo car takes more know how to own. There only as reliable as the owner is smart. The only other option is to make enough money to pay someone else to fix it. Most dick beaters with a china kit have niether.