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[nock]

almost forgot:

the real reason that header cracked is the lack of a DSM style balance shaft. everyone knows that a balance shaft improves dynamic balance and actually prevents all the accessories from failing. infact the primary reason for DSM failure is not the retarded owner, it's that the retarded owner removed the balance shafts (dumb asses) further more, if this engine had a few hundred thousand more miles on it, the crankshaft would have been able to follow it's own natural path, there-for not inducing harmful vibration into the header. apparently, there are advanced principles at work here that bisi clearly dose not understand.

[keelay]

almost forgot:

the real reason that header cracked is the lack of a DSM style balance shaft. everyone knows that a balance shaft improves dynamic balance and actually prevents all the accessories from failing. infact the primary reason for DSM failure is not the retarded owner, it's that the retarded owner removed the balance shafts (dumb asses) further more, if this engine had a few hundred thousand more miles on it, the crankshaft would have been able to follow it's own natural path, there-for not inducing harmful vibration into the header. apparently, there are advanced principles at work here that bisi clearly dose not understand.

wut?

[Corey]

i hope hes making fun of joseph davis and his vibration theories.

[keelay]

I hope he isn't serious. I thought that balance shafts serve NO harmonic purpose at all

[crttaz]

Right. 

You are going to doubt what I say because you lack knowledge on the subject?

On dynamic balance?  No, I'm pretty up on the subject.  You aren't the only master class welder I've spoken to in my life, and I'll bet Greg hermann knows more about machining/tool and die/etc than you do.  The problem isn't joining the pipe it's the fact that it's a load at the end of the pipe that's being shaken by a super complicated paint mixer.  You will get cracks, it has nothing to do with the weld joints, if any, and in fact they won't neccesarily manifest at the welds.

No, I was referring to fabrication. I will admit I am no master tool and die guy, I am working on it, but it will take years of time. I realize, understand, and partially agree with what you are saying. However I disagree in the sense that I know how it can be avoided by using quality material, techniques, and design. It is the ignorance of these three things that lead to this type of failure, the widespread of this ignorance has created the acceptance of " it will fail, it is a matter of when not if".

I've seen some sweet bracing rigs, but ultimately it's a paint machine.  Metal fatigue sets in at some point.


Also, Matt, you have some interesting shit in your PB.

Unless someone made a second intake like that, I got to see the original at a CRX meet in Niagara.

N6 or N8, hrm, they were all a blur

[turbob16hatch]

I made that sweet abortion of a intake manifold back in 06-07 using the b16 plenum d16 flange out of some stuff laying around.

 

[Joseph Davis]

I fucking hate B16 IMs, but one would be a super sweet budget upgrade for a D16.  That's actually a great use for them.

[turbob16hatch]

What amazed me is how the ports are damn close to lining up.

[nock]

I hope he isn't serious. I thought that balance shafts serve NO harmonic purpose at all

oops:
they (kinda) equalize the 2nd order inbalance, that happens at 2x crank speed, you could call it a harmonic of the inbalance, or a dynamic inbalance on the vertical only. EDIT: or a 96oz togo cup, or whatever

if a piston at the top is traveling faster than the opposing piston (on the opposite crank throw) is at the bottom, the difference in the two accelerations is the inbalance. (hence the 90deg V8) this is why 4 cylinders are balanced without bob weights, you cant balance the second order, so there is no out of phase counter weight. i think this is why most 4 cylinders lean back in the engine bay. if you look at the 4g, the balance shaft in front is higher than the one in back, so the axis of the inbalance force is probably leaning to the back of the engine.  leaning the engine back even more in the engine bay would make this force more inline with the inertia of the car, trying to shake the car front to back instead of up and down. if im not full of shit (a remote possibility) this could be were broken headers come from. because the exhaust runs front to back and the car manufactures try to make the engine shake front to back. literally, the only way to fix this is to put a big old turbo high on the back of the engine with a flex joint as close to the turbo as possible.  :yes:

bisi probably invented balance shafts and sold the patent to mitsu and there pole smoking fagots who put it in everything. they just build whatever and use the shafts to get rid of the inbalance. car makers dont want to pay the licensing fee or use stupid ass shafts. honda uses lighter pistons and rods(+), toyoda has offset crankshafts, and volkswagon (ultimate fail) uses a rod so long that they have to use crazy baffles and a 10 gallon pan to keep oil from winding up the crank. other car makers just try to make there engine and tranny as heavy as possible, and mount it in such a away that as soon as it has any real power, it trys to rip itself out. (also VW) another good idea is to just put a V8 in it, thus eliminating all balance issues, at that point any design/implementation problems are purely trivial. if you have ever fixed a wrist watch with a sledge hammer you know what im talking about.

[Hotrodlincoln]

^^^^Amazing!

[crttaz]

I made that sweet abortion of a intake manifold back in 06-07 using the b16 plenum d16 flange out of some stuff laying around.

 

so yours was the second abortion.

The one I saw was a ZC intake flange + 2" runners with LS intake crapwelded on.

[turbob16hatch]

does that mean i lose 

[Joseph Davis]

ZC != D16, so in my book you're still a winner.

[nock]

ZC = win
VW, mitsu = fail

with regard to inbalance anyway.

[SDRAWKCAB]

pretty much.

if i had to guess on that header when that runner was built there was some shrinkage when welded and that stress pulling on the runner found the weakest weld, and probably at at hottest point (closest to port) and it failed. im sure its a mixture of poor welding and no backpurge. ill give the guy credit it looks to be assembled well and id hate to have to build one of those over complicated POS.

Agreed, most fabricators underestimate the importance of fit up on tube assemblies. If it doesn't fit like this:




than you don't weld it.

LIES
If you cant fill the space with random bolts and other miscellaneous metal items
you still weld it, then use JB weld after.
BITCHES

[Joseph Davis]

pretty much.

if i had to guess on that header when that runner was built there was some shrinkage when welded and that stress pulling on the runner found the weakest weld, and probably at at hottest point (closest to port) and it failed. im sure its a mixture of poor welding and no backpurge. ill give the guy credit it looks to be assembled well and id hate to have to build one of those over complicated POS.

Agreed, most fabricators underestimate the importance of fit up on tube assemblies. If it doesn't fit like this:




than you don't weld it.

LIES
If you cant fill the space with random bolts and other miscellaneous metal items
you still weld it, then use JB weld after.
BITCHES

[98vtec]

MADE IN TAIWAN

Hello "vteckidd" headers

[bigdaddyvtec]

Ya but at least vteckidd is honest about it... LOL. 

You see the thread about all those NA header clowns calling each other out? 

[turbob16hatch]

Ya but at least vteckidd is honest about it... LOL. 

You see the thread about all those NA header clowns calling each other out? 

well if these bottom feeders(replica shit,yO parts) would just build/sell some nice parts not China/ Taiwan junk there wouldn't be the shit Honda community, when it comes to parts sales.

Yeah you sold 50 shitty headers you did nothing to call your own, wheres the pride in that?

I don't get it.

Also

[bigdaddyvtec]

I agree        Just sayin

[turbob16hatch]

I agree        Just sayin

Yeah I just get irritated on the subject because everyone thinks they should pay peanuts for custom or nicely built stuff, because vtekkidd sell shit cheap, yadda yadda.

 

[Joseph Davis]

Ya but at least vteckidd is honest about it... LOL. 

I like honest people.  Always liked him.

[DRQPQUT]

http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=143273

[bigdaddyvtec]

and thennnnn?

[arsenio]

NO AND THEN!

[Joseph Davis]

I believe it.  B20 motors pick up 20whp with no tuning when you bolt on LS intake and exhaust manifolds.

[turbob16hatch]

http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=143273

Do tell what you are trying to prove?

[DRQPQUT]

i just found it interesting that the mods locked that thread not allowing any questions to be answered in public...that and the nut swinging is funny it makes for entertaining reading idiots asking and idiots responding, grab your hip waders the shit gets thick on that site

[bigdaddyvtec]

I find it funny youre fat.


Merry Xmas homes......  Im going to dads fopr a few hours then Ill be at the Hall....  Lets meet up later and ill kicvk you in the gooch.

[DRQPQUT]

hey this isnt yahoo dont be instant messaging me....smooches